From: Christoph Hellwig on
Luc, can you please take your corporate bullshit out of this? I can
assume you know Dave personally and should be clearly aware that he's
everything but a corporate drone.

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From: Anton Vorontsov on
On Fri, Jul 02, 2010 at 01:10:29PM +0200, Luc Verhaegen wrote:
[...]
> > They'll keep shipping closed stuff, just like they are now. Are you
> > going to reverse engineer the userspace drivers, so people who care
> > about open and free software platforms can use these drivers? (or have
> > you already signed NDAs saying you can't). Why should we maintain a
> > bunch of kernel code, when they are hiding away all the really useful
> > stuff that people could improve.
>
> Maintaining this exact code is not _your_ job, [...]

Correct, it's not solely his job, but it's also every kernel
developers' job.

When I change kernel API I have to grep through all the kernel
drivers, sometimes understand how they work, and then make the
change to the whole kernel source tree.

And I would not want to maintain this code, as these drivers
are wasting my time without returning anything back.

It was said many times. Actually, so many times that it started
to become boring to repeat, and the Kernel Driver Statement was
written:

"We, the undersigned Linux kernel developers, consider any
closed-source Linux kernel module or driver to be harmful and
undesirable."

http://www.linuxfoundation.org/collaborate/publications/kernel-driver-statement

While the doc mostly says "kernel code", I truly believe that
there's actually no huge difference between "closed-source
kernel module" and "open source dummy kernel module + userspace
blob".

Both are closed source solutions, and generally useless for the
open source. And, what is worse, the last one is harmful for me
personally.

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Anton Vorontsov
email: cbouatmailru(a)gmail.com
irc://irc.freenode.net/bd2
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From: C. Bergström on
Xavier Bestel wrote:
> On Fri, 2010-07-02 at 19:07 +0700, "C. Bergström" wrote:
>
>> Dave Airlie wrote:
>>
>>> What potential? there are maybe 6 players on the ARM graphics scene
>>>
>>> ...
>>> Nvidia - well we know their position will never change.
>>>
>>>
>> Never say never. I have every reason to believe that Nvidia would
>> respond to market demand.
>>
>
> Could you share those interesting reasons with us ?
>
I thought I stated that the main reason was market demand?

(Some of my own comments not representing any company)
By market I mean revenue... The Linux and FOSS world isn't exactly a
huge market for high end graphics cards and total sales. With the Tesla
series of cards and most HPC clusters behing Linux powered this has the
potential to change things. Maybe I'm too optimistic and biased, but
from my perspective I think there's a change in the winds coming..
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From: Ian Romanick on
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Luc Verhaegen wrote:

> Since redhat is then not working with qualcomm, why is this then your responsibility?

I find that sentiment surprising from somebody who has actually met Dave. :/
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From: Pavel Machek on
Hi!

> >There is no point supporting companies that give you a little bit of
> >information in exchange they want the support that being in a mainline
> >kernel gives. Its an unfair exchange of knowledge and time, and if they
> >claim they have to make a profit then its even more unfair.
>
> also, they seem to do it quite wrong way. i.e. much simpler would be
> to just implement regular, open driver , and implement additional
> crypto
> mechanism in chipset itself, allowing to use simple userspace program
> sending certified keys allowing GPU to operate.

What is going on there? Does msm actually use crypto to prevent you
from use hardware you bought?

Are the keys device-specific? What prevents me from
reverse-engineering their binary and publishing them?
Pavel

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