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From: Mladen Gogala on 30 Jun 2010 23:50
If I write things with the intermediate variables like below, everything
works:

>>> x="quick brown fox jumps over a lazy dog"
>>> y=list(x)
>>> y
['q', 'u', 'i', 'c', 'k', ' ', 'b', 'r', 'o', 'w', 'n', ' ', 'f', 'o',
'x', ' ', 'j', 'u', 'm', 'p', 's', ' ', 'o', 'v', 'e', 'r', ' ', 'a', '
', 'l', 'a', 'z', 'y', ' ', 'd', 'o', 'g']
>>> y.reverse()
>>> y
['g', 'o', 'd', ' ', 'y', 'z', 'a', 'l', ' ', 'a', ' ', 'r', 'e', 'v',
'o', ' ', 's', 'p', 'm', 'u', 'j', ' ', 'x', 'o', 'f', ' ', 'n', 'w',
'o', 'r', 'b', ' ', 'k', 'c', 'i', 'u', 'q']
>>> z=''.join(y)
>>> z
'god yzal a revo spmuj xof nworb kciuq'

That is all well and kosher. Now, if I try to shorten things up, I will
get a type error:

>>> x="quick brown fox jumps over a lazy dog"
>>> y=''.join(list(x).reverse())
Traceback (most recent call last):
File "<stdin>", line 1, in <module>
TypeError
>>>

Why is TypeError being thrown? The reason for throwing the type error is
the fact that the internal expression evaluates to None and cannot,
therefore, be joined:

>>> y=list(x).reverse()
>>> print y
None

And that is strange. From the example above, I saw that if I assigned the
intermediate array to hold list(x), did the reverse on that variable and
then did "join", everything works as advertised. Version of Python is
2.6.5 on Ubuntu 10. Why is the intermediate variable necessary?
I am a complete newbie and am trying the usual stuff, reversing strings,
displaying them in hex, writing things to file "test1.txt" and alike.
--

http://mgogala.byethost5.com
From: Stephen Hansen on 1 Jul 2010 00:04
On 6/30/10 8:50 PM, Mladen Gogala wrote:
>>>> x="quick brown fox jumps over a lazy dog"
>>>> y=''.join(list(x).reverse())
> Traceback (most recent call last):
> File "<stdin>", line 1, in<module>
> TypeError
>>>>
>

> Why is TypeError being thrown? The reason for throwing the type error is
> the fact that the internal expression evaluates to None and cannot,
> therefore, be joined:

The "reverse" method, like "sort" and a couple others, are in-place
operations. Meaning, they do not return a new list but modify the
existing list. All methods that are "in-place" modifications return None
to indicate this. This way you can't make a mistake and think its
returning a sorted / reversed copy but it isn't.

However, you can easily get what you want by using the 'reversed'
function (and similarly, the 'sorted' function), a la:

>>> y = ''.join(reversed(list(x)))

The 'reversed' and 'sorted' functions are generators that lazilly
convert an iterable as needed.

--

... Stephen Hansen
... Also: Ixokai
... Mail: me+list/python (AT) ixokai (DOT) io
... Blog: http://meh.ixokai.io/

From: Chris Rebert on 1 Jul 2010 00:16
On Wed, Jun 30, 2010 at 9:09 PM, Zubin Mithra <zubin.mithra(a)gmail.com> wrote:
> Hello,
>
>> >>> y=list(x).reverse()
>> >>> print y
>> None
>
>>>> L = ["a", "b", "c"]
>>>> L.reverse()
>>>> L
> ["c", "b", "a"]
>
> As you can see, L.reverse() performs the operation on itself and returns
> nothing. Hence, the return type None.
>
> Instead of
>
> y=''.join(list(x).reverse())
>
> you should probably do,
>
>>>> t = list(x).reverse()
>>>> y = ''.join(t)

Er, I don't think you thought that one entirely through (/ tried it out):

chris(a)morpheus ~ $ python
Python 2.6.5 (r265:79063, May 25 2010, 18:21:57)
[GCC 4.2.1 (Apple Inc. build 5659)] on darwin
Type "help", "copyright", "credits" or "license" for more information.
>>> x = "hello"
>>> t = list(x).reverse()
>>> print t
None
>>> ''.join(t)
Traceback (most recent call last):
File "<stdin>", line 1, in <module>
TypeError

Cheers,
Chris
--
http://blog.rebertia.com
From: Mladen Gogala on 1 Jul 2010 00:32
On Wed, 30 Jun 2010 21:04:28 -0700, Stephen Hansen wrote:

> On 6/30/10 8:50 PM, Mladen Gogala wrote:
>>>>> x="quick brown fox jumps over a lazy dog"
>>>>> y=''.join(list(x).reverse())
>> Traceback (most recent call last):
>> File "<stdin>", line 1, in<module>
>> TypeError
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>
>> Why is TypeError being thrown? The reason for throwing the type error
>> is the fact that the internal expression evaluates to None and cannot,
>> therefore, be joined:
>
> The "reverse" method, like "sort" and a couple others, are in-place
> operations. Meaning, they do not return a new list but modify the
> existing list. All methods that are "in-place" modifications return None
> to indicate this. This way you can't make a mistake and think its
> returning a sorted / reversed copy but it isn't.

Thanks.

>
> However, you can easily get what you want by using the 'reversed'
> function (and similarly, the 'sorted' function), a la:
>
> >>> y = ''.join(reversed(list(x)))
>
> The 'reversed' and 'sorted' functions are generators that lazilly
> convert an iterable as needed.

Ah, that is even better. Thanks.



--
http://mgogala.byethost5.com
From: Terry Reedy on 1 Jul 2010 03:45
On 7/1/2010 12:32 AM, Mladen Gogala wrote:
> On Wed, 30 Jun 2010 21:04:28 -0700, Stephen Hansen wrote:

>> However, you can easily get what you want by using the 'reversed'
>> function (and similarly, the 'sorted' function), a la:
>>
>> >>> y = ''.join(reversed(list(x)))
>>
>> The 'reversed' and 'sorted' functions are generators that lazilly
>> convert an iterable as needed.
>
> Ah, that is even better. Thanks.

It is better if you do not mind making an unnecessary copy. If the list
had 10 million elements, you might prefer your original. And by the way,
sequential statements are a form of composition, even if strict
functionalists do not like to see it that way.

--
Terry Jan Reedy

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