Epsons designed to stop??
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From: Burt on 23 May 2005 14:13 For better or worse, Sensient doesn't appear to want to deal with small quantity sales. If you want to buy palattes of gallons or drums of their inks that is the market they have chosen to occupy. The smaller quantity repackagers have found the niche market that we occupy. This is true in many industries. "measekite" <measekite(a)yahoo.com> wrote in message news:g8oke.663$rY6.141(a)newssvr13.news.prodigy.com... > > > Burt wrote: > >>"measekite" <measekite(a)yahoo.com> wrote in message >>news:Uvnke.644$rY6.593(a)newssvr13.news.prodigy.com... >> >>(snip) >> >> >>>Notwithstanding my feeling about the 3rd party ink hawkers and the way >>>they do business along with many poor quality inks that can damage >>>printers, I would like to see a strong, honest, professional, and full >>>disclosing aftermarket ink industry that will sell BRANDED ink in both >>>bottles and prefilled carts through all of the marketing channels (Brick >>>& Mortor like Costco and Office Depot as well online) . This will help >>>to drive down the overpriced OEM ink alternatives. >>> >> >>The model that current internet vendors use for third party ink/cart sales >>is considerably less expensive than even the "big box" brick and mortar >>businesses such as Costco and Office Depot. Although you don't like >>theses e-vendors' business methods and disparage them constantly, they >>offer the consumer the best pricing on these products. Add more >>sophisticated packaging, more personel and management salaries, and >>another layer or more of profit taking in the chain of distribution, and >>the prices go up considerably for these products. In addition, I would >>bet that the OEM products would not drop in price with broader >>distribution of third party products. Market forces notwithstanding, the >>public is generally fearful of straying from the manufacturers' >>recommendations. >> > > And with good reason. However, I said that the distribution by > manufacturers should be between all of the channels. Let say that > Sensinet packaged 2oz and 4 oz bottles as well as prefilled carts and sold > them on their own webstore just like Canon and Epson as well as through > brick and mortar stores under their own name. You could then choose to > buy that BRAND anywhere and compare prices as well. Once Sensinet > established BRAND recognition with the public Epson and Canon would have a > viable competitor. Once sales are taken away from them they would have to > rethink their pricing. > > Also, if it was proved that their ink was inferior and you were getting is > from Costco, you would not turn to Office Depot and unknowingly buy the > same thing. > >> >>>>measekite wrote: >>>> >>>> >>(snip) >> >>
From: lindsay@clanahan.fslife.co.uk on 23 May 2005 15:17 I have an Epson C70+ colour inkjet printer.I have just spent £65 on 2 cartridges , 1 black and 1 colour.While knowing that this is a chipped cartridge, I resent the fact that I have to spend this kind of money just to get refills for a printer.In future, when it comes times to replace, my printer, I will not be buying an Epson. They have just about the most expensive refill cartridges of any manufacturer that I have come across.When companies ( not just Epson, but others do come to mind as well ) make their hardware, they really should give a thought for the upkeep of their equipment for the low end private user. If someone could also provide me with drivers for above printer, running on an XP home Packard Bell Easynote C3300, I would also be most grateful. Mr. J. Lindsay Clanahan lindsay(a)clanahan.fslife.co.uk
From: measekite on 23 May 2005 15:30 Burt wrote: >For better or worse, Sensient doesn't appear to want to deal with small >quantity sales. > That is worse. >If you want to buy palattes of gallons or drums of their >inks that is the market they have chosen to occupy. The smaller quantity >repackagers > Hawkers >have found the niche market that we occupy. This is true in >many industries. > >"measekite" <measekite(a)yahoo.com> wrote in message >news:g8oke.663$rY6.141(a)newssvr13.news.prodigy.com... > > >>Burt wrote: >> >> >> >>>"measekite" <measekite(a)yahoo.com> wrote in message >>>news:Uvnke.644$rY6.593(a)newssvr13.news.prodigy.com... >>> >>>(snip) >>> >>> >>> >>> >>>>Notwithstanding my feeling about the 3rd party ink hawkers and the way >>>>they do business along with many poor quality inks that can damage >>>>printers, I would like to see a strong, honest, professional, and full >>>>disclosing aftermarket ink industry that will sell BRANDED ink in both >>>>bottles and prefilled carts through all of the marketing channels (Brick >>>>& Mortor like Costco and Office Depot as well online) . This will help >>>>to drive down the overpriced OEM ink alternatives. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>The model that current internet vendors use for third party ink/cart sales >>>is considerably less expensive than even the "big box" brick and mortar >>>businesses such as Costco and Office Depot. Although you don't like >>>theses e-vendors' business methods and disparage them constantly, they >>>offer the consumer the best pricing on these products. Add more >>>sophisticated packaging, more personel and management salaries, and >>>another layer or more of profit taking in the chain of distribution, and >>>the prices go up considerably for these products. In addition, I would >>>bet that the OEM products would not drop in price with broader >>>distribution of third party products. Market forces notwithstanding, the >>>public is generally fearful of straying from the manufacturers' >>>recommendations. >>> >>> >>> >>And with good reason. However, I said that the distribution by >>manufacturers should be between all of the channels. Let say that >>Sensinet packaged 2oz and 4 oz bottles as well as prefilled carts and sold >>them on their own webstore just like Canon and Epson as well as through >>brick and mortar stores under their own name. You could then choose to >>buy that BRAND anywhere and compare prices as well. Once Sensinet >>established BRAND recognition with the public Epson and Canon would have a >>viable competitor. Once sales are taken away from them they would have to >>rethink their pricing. >> >>Also, if it was proved that their ink was inferior and you were getting is >>from Costco, you would not turn to Office Depot and unknowingly buy the >>same thing. >> >> >> >>>>>measekite wrote: >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>(snip) >>> >>> >>> >>> > > > >
From: Davy on 23 May 2005 16:38 > Arthur Entlichwrote: > > the dang tube tends to fall off during cartridge > replacement, so all the sudden the printer stops working after a > cartridge has been replaced. > > Davy say's, > Bearing in mind the new cartridge will be full so when it goes through the head cleaning routine the pressure is gonna be at it's most max due to the weight of the ink and gravity just like systole pressure of the heart, sounds quite feesible. > > A cure is to use a plastic cable tie. > > Davy
From: Arthur Entlich on 24 May 2005 07:18
I neither forgot nor did I include Microsoft. In order to get a strong and honest aftermarket for ink suppliers, there are several matters to overcome which make much of it impossible. The manufacturers need to spell out what their specs and requirements are, and a 3rd party foundation which is sponsored by 3rd party ink suppliers, but independent of them, needs to test and scrutinize the inks made. Won't happen because manufacturers have no interest in revealing the specs and requirements of the printers they make when their profit engine IS their inks. Won't happen because 3rd party ink manufacturers distribute their inks to many, many distribution channels and might even make the ink for the OEM, and contracts and NDAs do not allow them to reveal this. Ink formulation is only part of the issue. Cartridges and or heads have to be designed to spec also. And finally, longevity of the ink is a very costly process to allow for good advanced aging estimate. Of the majors, Lexmark, Dell, HP and Epson have all developed methods to confound refilling. Art measekite wrote: > > > Arthur Entlich wrote: > >> I don't disagree. I find this to be a pervasive problem in the >> computer hardware business. I have rarely found a company that >> doesn't shirk some of it's responsibilities. Canon, as an example >> seem less than forthright about the stability of their ink, and the >> reliability of their printer heads. They have developed a new head >> for their professional wide carriage printers and are supplying >> pigment colorant inks for them, with a gloss and matte ink, amazingly >> very similar sounding to Epson's ink system. >> >> I could enumerate personal stories with bad technology and poor >> company response from dozens of high tech companies, including Epson. > > > > You forgot about Microsoft. ;-) > >> I've never said otherwise. I just know a lot more about the issues >> with Epson products because I deal with people who encounter them. I >> don't think they have anything approaching a monopoly for problems, >> even in the printer industry, however, and they certainly do make some >> innovative designs along the way. >> >> Art > > > > While I use OEM ink (best for my purposes) Epson, more than the other > companies, have thus far put out designs that appears to foil or make > difficult using other ink. > Notwithstanding my feeling about the 3rd party ink hawkers and the way > they do business along with many poor quality inks that can damage > printers, I would like to see a strong, honest, professional, and full > disclosing aftermarket ink industry that will sell BRANDED ink in both > bottles and prefilled carts through all of the marketing channels (Brick > & Mortor like Costco and Office Depot as well online) . This will help > to drive down the overpriced OEM ink alternatives. > >> >> measekite wrote: >> >>> >>> >>> Arthur Entlich wrote: >>> >>>> The little suction pump reminds me of a miniature milking machine. >>>> >>>> I wish the problem with the tube coming off was just the C80. I >>>> have helped people with this problem with C82, C84, CX 5200, CX 4600 >>>> all in one. AND, worse yet, the dang tube tends to fall off during >>>> cartridge replacement, so all the sudden the printer stops working >>>> after a cartridge has been replaced. >>>> >>>> Worse still, Epson is very tight-lipped about it, and if it occurs >>>> out of warranty, they have nothing to say at all. >>>> >>>> I find that approach unreasonable. This is a manufacturing or >>>> design defect, and Epson ought to take responsibility for it. >>>> >>>> Art >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> It seems there are a lot of things that Epson does not take >>> responsibility for. >>> >>>> >>>> Davy wrote: >>>> >>>>> The pump system on many an Epson printer consist of a plastic tube the >>>>> far end connects to the waste pad. the pump end is situated, for >>>>> obvious reasons in the 'head park tray' just prior to where this is >>>>> connected it goes through a 'U' turn moulding, imagine a wheel with a >>>>> llittle bump or hammer on it rotating from a coupling from the paper >>>>> feed gears, as the wheel rotates the bump or hammer pushes against >>>>> the tube in a rotational manner, since the tube is being 'squashed' >>>>> in a 'U' formation causes the ink to be drawn through the tube by >>>>> suction. >>>>> >>>>> With the Picture Mate, the waste could well be collected by the ink >>>>> cartridge as waste in a seperate chamber and then 'thrown out' with >>>>> the empty tank, why not with all printers? >>>>> >>>>> Incidentally in a C80 this plastic tube is a common cause for bad >>>>> printing and clogged heads it has a habit of coming away from the >>>>> end of the head tray, causing ink to build and dry in the 'head >>>>> park'. >>>>> >>>>> Davy >>>>> |