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From: G.G.Willikers on 22 Apr 2008 06:34 Lars wrote: > Previously, on Usenet haligonab <stevieb(a)SPAMNOTiglou.com> wrote: > >>> I would definitely split that 120GB up. With a drive that size I would >>> also set the MY Documents folder on to a separate partition. >> Been doing that for years, but it's good that you mentioned it for >> others who might not have thought of it. > > Me too. Not you really need to know that. I just want to bring up why > it is not standard procedure to split a HD on a new brand desktop. > > A friend needs a new computer to replace her 8 year old. So I adviced > her to order a Dell. It comes with Vista preinstalled. 300 GB HD, all > in one partition. > > On my suggestion she requested that the drive be split 100/400, but no > go! The Dell guy sighs and smacks his tongue and probably rolls his > eyes, and eventually agrees that maybe she can have it split in the > middle. Or, he says, "she can split it herself". > > That is asking a lot from a sweet girl, who is a fast and accurate > typist, very good with Paint Shop Pro etc, but not a Dos person or at > all a computer nut, like guys here. She points to the computer chassi > and says "Hard drive, split it in two, how is that possible?" > > Lars > Stockholm If you take a gander at the Dell website, they CHARGE for the privilege of having your hard drive partitioned. ( probably due to the imaging process) I personally advise my friends NOT to invest in hard drives over 120GBs on a laptop. I tell them instead to invest in a full size external drive for large capacity storage.
From: Richard Carpenter on 22 Apr 2008 21:22 "haligonab" <stevieb(a)SPAMNOTiglou.com> wrote in message news:ho4n049egatqalslav5qlssv62mirkpmre(a)4ax.com... > Behringer ADA8000On Sat, 19 Apr 2008 03:04:43 -0400, "G.G.Willikers" > <noone(a)athome.com> wrote: > >>haligonab wrote: >>> On Tue, 15 Apr 2008 17:46:47 -0400, "G.G.Willikers" <noone(a)athome.com> >>> wrote: >>> >>>> haligonab wrote: >>>>> Hi, >>>>> >>>>> Apologies for my ignorance. I've been building my own desktops for 10 >>>>> years, but I've been told that laptops are different beasts. >>>>> >>>>> I just inherited a 5-year-old Toshiba A15-S127 from a friend. It >>>>> appears that the hard drive (original Toshiba) has given up the ghost. >>>>> When we booted it up, it ran a full scandisk (to my friend's surprise) >>>>> and corrected all errors and ran flawlessly for 3 hours. When we >>>>> rebooted it couldn't access the hard drive. He said his son had >>>>> dropped it more than once. I assume that the HD has been damaged, as >>>>> it displayed new errors when scandisk ran again. And again. Then I got >>>>> the "a disk read error has occurred" message over and over. Now all I >>>>> get is the Toshiba splash screen and a blinking cursor followed by a >>>>> blank screen. Hmm... now the "a disk read error has occurred" message >>>>> is back. >>>>> >>>>> BTW, I tried booting from an XP install disk. I got it to boot once >>>>> but it crashed during the system scan. Now it won't boot at all. >>>>> That's got me wondering if the IDE connector on the board could be >>>>> damaged? I can hear both the HDD and combo drives spin up. >>>>> >>>>> I'd rather not throw money at this if it seems to be a mobo problem, >>>>> but I wouldn't mind investing in a new hard drive. Any thoughts you >>>>> folks might offer would be greatly appreciated. Thanks! >>>>> >>>>> Steve >>>> Does it boot to BIOS? Does it display any problems while in BIOS? >>>> Does BIOS detect the CD ROM everytime you boot? >>>> Reseat memory. reseat the CD rom. If it took a fall the CDrom, while >>>> not >>>> exactly fragile, could be damaged. >>>> >>>> This could help your project along: >>>> >>>> http://www.irisvista.com/tech/laptops/ToshibaA15/SatelliteA15_laptop_disassembly_1.htm >>> >>> >>> Hi GG, >>> >>> My main problem is ignorance of laptops in general, but I'm learning. >>> I'm used to the desktop boot screen and hitting the delete key to >>> access BIOS. I'm not seeing anything familiar in this regard. A friend >>> suggested trying the function keys. F2 allowed me to select the boot >>> device from the Toshiba splash screen. I can now boot to my XP install >>> disk without fail, leading me to be more confident that this is just a >>> HD failure. I ordered a WD 120gb IDE drive from Newegg last night. >>> With any luck that will be all I need other than maxing the RAM and >>> adding wireless LAN. >>> >>> BTW, thanks much for the disassembly link, though I dearly hope I >>> won't need it. That's a whole lot more work than I care to get into >>> right now. >>> >>> Thanks to all you folks for your thoughts and suggestions. I think I >>> got the nudges I needed to start moving forward. >>> >>> Steve >> >>I would definitely split that 120GB up. With a drive that size I would >>also set the MY Documents folder on to a separate partition. That way if >>your OS has a some catastrophe, you still have all your lovely pictures >>and such. > > > Been doing that for years, but it's good that you mentioned it for > others who might not have thought of it. Saved my bacon on more than > one occasion. Plus I also back-up to an external USB drive. Redundency > is your friend. Thanks again! The external backup is definitely a necessity, but I can't say I necessarily agree with the *need* to split the hard drive into multiple partitions. I have owned a great many computers over the years (and built even more) and several laptops, and the only times I ever had hard drive problems involved a full crash. It wouldn't have mattered whether I had one or ten partitions. I've never had just one partition on a multi-partitioned drive fail on me, leaving the other partition(s) on the same drive intact. Besides, even if data files are moved to a second partition, if a partition *were* to fail, who's to say it wouldn't be the data partition? Redundancy and external backups are the only ways to protect your data. Multiple partitions on a single drive offers neither. I'm all in favor of multiple partitions for organizational and/or security reasons, but it just doesn't seem to offer much in the way of protection against hardware or system failure. -- Richard Carpenter
From: G.G.Willikers on 22 Apr 2008 21:29 Richard Carpenter wrote: > "haligonab" <stevieb(a)SPAMNOTiglou.com> wrote in message > news:ho4n049egatqalslav5qlssv62mirkpmre(a)4ax.com... >> Behringer ADA8000On Sat, 19 Apr 2008 03:04:43 -0400, "G.G.Willikers" >> <noone(a)athome.com> wrote: >> >>> haligonab wrote: >>>> On Tue, 15 Apr 2008 17:46:47 -0400, "G.G.Willikers" <noone(a)athome.com> >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> haligonab wrote: >>>>>> Hi, >>>>>> >>>>>> Apologies for my ignorance. I've been building my own desktops for 10 >>>>>> years, but I've been told that laptops are different beasts. >>>>>> >>>>>> I just inherited a 5-year-old Toshiba A15-S127 from a friend. It >>>>>> appears that the hard drive (original Toshiba) has given up the >>>>>> ghost. >>>>>> When we booted it up, it ran a full scandisk (to my friend's >>>>>> surprise) >>>>>> and corrected all errors and ran flawlessly for 3 hours. When we >>>>>> rebooted it couldn't access the hard drive. He said his son had >>>>>> dropped it more than once. I assume that the HD has been damaged, as >>>>>> it displayed new errors when scandisk ran again. And again. Then I >>>>>> got >>>>>> the "a disk read error has occurred" message over and over. Now all I >>>>>> get is the Toshiba splash screen and a blinking cursor followed by a >>>>>> blank screen. Hmm... now the "a disk read error has occurred" message >>>>>> is back. >>>>>> >>>>>> BTW, I tried booting from an XP install disk. I got it to boot once >>>>>> but it crashed during the system scan. Now it won't boot at all. >>>>>> That's got me wondering if the IDE connector on the board could be >>>>>> damaged? I can hear both the HDD and combo drives spin up. >>>>>> >>>>>> I'd rather not throw money at this if it seems to be a mobo problem, >>>>>> but I wouldn't mind investing in a new hard drive. Any thoughts you >>>>>> folks might offer would be greatly appreciated. Thanks! >>>>>> >>>>>> Steve >>>>> Does it boot to BIOS? Does it display any problems while in BIOS? >>>>> Does BIOS detect the CD ROM everytime you boot? >>>>> Reseat memory. reseat the CD rom. If it took a fall the CDrom, >>>>> while not >>>>> exactly fragile, could be damaged. >>>>> >>>>> This could help your project along: >>>>> >>>>> http://www.irisvista.com/tech/laptops/ToshibaA15/SatelliteA15_laptop_disassembly_1.htm >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Hi GG, >>>> >>>> My main problem is ignorance of laptops in general, but I'm learning. >>>> I'm used to the desktop boot screen and hitting the delete key to >>>> access BIOS. I'm not seeing anything familiar in this regard. A friend >>>> suggested trying the function keys. F2 allowed me to select the boot >>>> device from the Toshiba splash screen. I can now boot to my XP install >>>> disk without fail, leading me to be more confident that this is just a >>>> HD failure. I ordered a WD 120gb IDE drive from Newegg last night. >>>> With any luck that will be all I need other than maxing the RAM and >>>> adding wireless LAN. >>>> >>>> BTW, thanks much for the disassembly link, though I dearly hope I >>>> won't need it. That's a whole lot more work than I care to get into >>>> right now. >>>> >>>> Thanks to all you folks for your thoughts and suggestions. I think I >>>> got the nudges I needed to start moving forward. >>>> >>>> Steve >>> >>> I would definitely split that 120GB up. With a drive that size I would >>> also set the MY Documents folder on to a separate partition. That way if >>> your OS has a some catastrophe, you still have all your lovely pictures >>> and such. >> >> >> Been doing that for years, but it's good that you mentioned it for >> others who might not have thought of it. Saved my bacon on more than >> one occasion. Plus I also back-up to an external USB drive. Redundency >> is your friend. Thanks again! > > The external backup is definitely a necessity, but I can't say I > necessarily agree with the *need* to split the hard drive into multiple > partitions. I have owned a great many computers over the years (and > built even more) and several laptops, and the only times I ever had hard > drive problems involved a full crash. It wouldn't have mattered whether > I had one or ten partitions. I've never had just one partition on a > multi-partitioned drive fail on me, leaving the other partition(s) on > the same drive intact. Besides, even if data files are moved to a second > partition, if a partition *were* to fail, who's to say it wouldn't be > the data partition? Redundancy and external backups are the only ways to > protect your data. Multiple partitions on a single drive offers neither. > > I'm all in favor of multiple partitions for organizational and/or > security reasons, but it just doesn't seem to offer much in the way of > protection against hardware or system failure. > I really wasnt really referring to catastrophic drive faliure (Physical), but more along the lines of seperating the OS from the files people hold near and dear. Writing an image file for a 30 gig OS partition is far easier than writing an image file for a 300 gig partition. Thats where I was going with that.
From: John Doue on 23 Apr 2008 00:58 G.G.Willikers wrote: > Richard Carpenter wrote: >> "haligonab" <stevieb(a)SPAMNOTiglou.com> wrote in message >> news:ho4n049egatqalslav5qlssv62mirkpmre(a)4ax.com... >>> Behringer ADA8000On Sat, 19 Apr 2008 03:04:43 -0400, "G.G.Willikers" >>> <noone(a)athome.com> wrote: >>> >>>> haligonab wrote: >>>>> On Tue, 15 Apr 2008 17:46:47 -0400, "G.G.Willikers" <noone(a)athome.com> >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> haligonab wrote: >>>>>>> Hi, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Apologies for my ignorance. I've been building my own desktops >>>>>>> for 10 >>>>>>> years, but I've been told that laptops are different beasts. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I just inherited a 5-year-old Toshiba A15-S127 from a friend. It >>>>>>> appears that the hard drive (original Toshiba) has given up the >>>>>>> ghost. >>>>>>> When we booted it up, it ran a full scandisk (to my friend's >>>>>>> surprise) >>>>>>> and corrected all errors and ran flawlessly for 3 hours. When we >>>>>>> rebooted it couldn't access the hard drive. He said his son had >>>>>>> dropped it more than once. I assume that the HD has been damaged, as >>>>>>> it displayed new errors when scandisk ran again. And again. Then >>>>>>> I got >>>>>>> the "a disk read error has occurred" message over and over. Now >>>>>>> all I >>>>>>> get is the Toshiba splash screen and a blinking cursor followed by a >>>>>>> blank screen. Hmm... now the "a disk read error has occurred" >>>>>>> message >>>>>>> is back. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> BTW, I tried booting from an XP install disk. I got it to boot once >>>>>>> but it crashed during the system scan. Now it won't boot at all. >>>>>>> That's got me wondering if the IDE connector on the board could be >>>>>>> damaged? I can hear both the HDD and combo drives spin up. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I'd rather not throw money at this if it seems to be a mobo problem, >>>>>>> but I wouldn't mind investing in a new hard drive. Any thoughts you >>>>>>> folks might offer would be greatly appreciated. Thanks! >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Steve >>>>>> Does it boot to BIOS? Does it display any problems while in BIOS? >>>>>> Does BIOS detect the CD ROM everytime you boot? >>>>>> Reseat memory. reseat the CD rom. If it took a fall the CDrom, >>>>>> while not >>>>>> exactly fragile, could be damaged. >>>>>> >>>>>> This could help your project along: >>>>>> >>>>>> http://www.irisvista.com/tech/laptops/ToshibaA15/SatelliteA15_laptop_disassembly_1.htm >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Hi GG, >>>>> >>>>> My main problem is ignorance of laptops in general, but I'm learning. >>>>> I'm used to the desktop boot screen and hitting the delete key to >>>>> access BIOS. I'm not seeing anything familiar in this regard. A friend >>>>> suggested trying the function keys. F2 allowed me to select the boot >>>>> device from the Toshiba splash screen. I can now boot to my XP install >>>>> disk without fail, leading me to be more confident that this is just a >>>>> HD failure. I ordered a WD 120gb IDE drive from Newegg last night. >>>>> With any luck that will be all I need other than maxing the RAM and >>>>> adding wireless LAN. >>>>> >>>>> BTW, thanks much for the disassembly link, though I dearly hope I >>>>> won't need it. That's a whole lot more work than I care to get into >>>>> right now. >>>>> >>>>> Thanks to all you folks for your thoughts and suggestions. I think I >>>>> got the nudges I needed to start moving forward. >>>>> >>>>> Steve >>>> >>>> I would definitely split that 120GB up. With a drive that size I would >>>> also set the MY Documents folder on to a separate partition. That >>>> way if >>>> your OS has a some catastrophe, you still have all your lovely pictures >>>> and such. >>> >>> >>> Been doing that for years, but it's good that you mentioned it for >>> others who might not have thought of it. Saved my bacon on more than >>> one occasion. Plus I also back-up to an external USB drive. Redundency >>> is your friend. Thanks again! >> >> The external backup is definitely a necessity, but I can't say I >> necessarily agree with the *need* to split the hard drive into >> multiple partitions. I have owned a great many computers over the >> years (and built even more) and several laptops, and the only times I >> ever had hard drive problems involved a full crash. It wouldn't have >> mattered whether I had one or ten partitions. I've never had just one >> partition on a multi-partitioned drive fail on me, leaving the other >> partition(s) on the same drive intact. Besides, even if data files are >> moved to a second partition, if a partition *were* to fail, who's to >> say it wouldn't be the data partition? Redundancy and external backups >> are the only ways to protect your data. Multiple partitions on a >> single drive offers neither. >> >> I'm all in favor of multiple partitions for organizational and/or >> security reasons, but it just doesn't seem to offer much in the way of >> protection against hardware or system failure. >> > > I really wasnt really referring to catastrophic drive faliure > (Physical), but more along the lines of seperating the OS from the files > people hold near and dear. Writing an image file for a 30 gig OS > partition is far easier than writing an image file for a 300 gig > partition. Thats where I was going with that. Although there will never be one definitive answer on the subject, common sense demands that you use the same approach in storing data as in storing any personal items or files: organizing storage according to rational criterias makes things easier to find, limits the risks of destructing or damage and more generally, makes your life easier. Partitioning will not limit the physical risk to a drive but will clearly, as you state, facilitate backups (call it imaging if you like), and limit risks of accidental deletions: directories can get easily deleted, but partitions are not things you mess with on a daily basis. Finally, when something goes wrong when installing or uninstalling a program, when a software crash happens, partitioning limits the extent of the damage. I believe in having one partition for the OS, one for the programs, and one for the data. The only draw back of partitioning is, first it requires a minimum of understanding of what you are doing, and with Vista, the initial partitioning can be difficult to modify. Second, it requires an organized mind and some discipline to be of real benefit. Comparing the way people *organize* their garages will probably tell you a lot about the way they store their data ... Regards -- John Doue
From: G.G.Willikers on 23 Apr 2008 02:02 John Doue wrote: > G.G.Willikers wrote: >> Richard Carpenter wrote: >>> "haligonab" <stevieb(a)SPAMNOTiglou.com> wrote in message >>> news:ho4n049egatqalslav5qlssv62mirkpmre(a)4ax.com... >>>> Behringer ADA8000On Sat, 19 Apr 2008 03:04:43 -0400, "G.G.Willikers" >>>> <noone(a)athome.com> wrote: >>>> >>>>> haligonab wrote: >>>>>> On Tue, 15 Apr 2008 17:46:47 -0400, "G.G.Willikers" >>>>>> <noone(a)athome.com> >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> haligonab wrote: >>>>>>>> Hi, >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Apologies for my ignorance. I've been building my own desktops >>>>>>>> for 10 >>>>>>>> years, but I've been told that laptops are different beasts. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I just inherited a 5-year-old Toshiba A15-S127 from a friend. It >>>>>>>> appears that the hard drive (original Toshiba) has given up the >>>>>>>> ghost. >>>>>>>> When we booted it up, it ran a full scandisk (to my friend's >>>>>>>> surprise) >>>>>>>> and corrected all errors and ran flawlessly for 3 hours. When we >>>>>>>> rebooted it couldn't access the hard drive. He said his son had >>>>>>>> dropped it more than once. I assume that the HD has been >>>>>>>> damaged, as >>>>>>>> it displayed new errors when scandisk ran again. And again. Then >>>>>>>> I got >>>>>>>> the "a disk read error has occurred" message over and over. Now >>>>>>>> all I >>>>>>>> get is the Toshiba splash screen and a blinking cursor followed >>>>>>>> by a >>>>>>>> blank screen. Hmm... now the "a disk read error has occurred" >>>>>>>> message >>>>>>>> is back. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> BTW, I tried booting from an XP install disk. I got it to boot once >>>>>>>> but it crashed during the system scan. Now it won't boot at all. >>>>>>>> That's got me wondering if the IDE connector on the board could be >>>>>>>> damaged? I can hear both the HDD and combo drives spin up. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I'd rather not throw money at this if it seems to be a mobo >>>>>>>> problem, >>>>>>>> but I wouldn't mind investing in a new hard drive. Any thoughts you >>>>>>>> folks might offer would be greatly appreciated. Thanks! >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Steve >>>>>>> Does it boot to BIOS? Does it display any problems while in BIOS? >>>>>>> Does BIOS detect the CD ROM everytime you boot? >>>>>>> Reseat memory. reseat the CD rom. If it took a fall the CDrom, >>>>>>> while not >>>>>>> exactly fragile, could be damaged. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> This could help your project along: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> http://www.irisvista.com/tech/laptops/ToshibaA15/SatelliteA15_laptop_disassembly_1.htm >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Hi GG, >>>>>> >>>>>> My main problem is ignorance of laptops in general, but I'm learning. >>>>>> I'm used to the desktop boot screen and hitting the delete key to >>>>>> access BIOS. I'm not seeing anything familiar in this regard. A >>>>>> friend >>>>>> suggested trying the function keys. F2 allowed me to select the boot >>>>>> device from the Toshiba splash screen. I can now boot to my XP >>>>>> install >>>>>> disk without fail, leading me to be more confident that this is >>>>>> just a >>>>>> HD failure. I ordered a WD 120gb IDE drive from Newegg last night. >>>>>> With any luck that will be all I need other than maxing the RAM and >>>>>> adding wireless LAN. >>>>>> >>>>>> BTW, thanks much for the disassembly link, though I dearly hope I >>>>>> won't need it. That's a whole lot more work than I care to get into >>>>>> right now. >>>>>> >>>>>> Thanks to all you folks for your thoughts and suggestions. I think I >>>>>> got the nudges I needed to start moving forward. >>>>>> >>>>>> Steve >>>>> >>>>> I would definitely split that 120GB up. With a drive that size I would >>>>> also set the MY Documents folder on to a separate partition. That >>>>> way if >>>>> your OS has a some catastrophe, you still have all your lovely >>>>> pictures >>>>> and such. >>>> >>>> >>>> Been doing that for years, but it's good that you mentioned it for >>>> others who might not have thought of it. Saved my bacon on more than >>>> one occasion. Plus I also back-up to an external USB drive. Redundency >>>> is your friend. Thanks again! >>> >>> The external backup is definitely a necessity, but I can't say I >>> necessarily agree with the *need* to split the hard drive into >>> multiple partitions. I have owned a great many computers over the >>> years (and built even more) and several laptops, and the only times I >>> ever had hard drive problems involved a full crash. It wouldn't have >>> mattered whether I had one or ten partitions. I've never had just one >>> partition on a multi-partitioned drive fail on me, leaving the other >>> partition(s) on the same drive intact. Besides, even if data files >>> are moved to a second partition, if a partition *were* to fail, who's >>> to say it wouldn't be the data partition? Redundancy and external >>> backups are the only ways to protect your data. Multiple partitions >>> on a single drive offers neither. >>> >>> I'm all in favor of multiple partitions for organizational and/or >>> security reasons, but it just doesn't seem to offer much in the way >>> of protection against hardware or system failure. >>> >> >> I really wasnt really referring to catastrophic drive faliure >> (Physical), but more along the lines of seperating the OS from the >> files people hold near and dear. Writing an image file for a 30 gig OS >> partition is far easier than writing an image file for a 300 gig >> partition. Thats where I was going with that. > > Although there will never be one definitive answer on the subject, > common sense demands that you use the same approach in storing data as > in storing any personal items or files: organizing storage according to > rational criterias makes things easier to find, limits the risks of > destructing or damage and more generally, makes your life easier. > > Partitioning will not limit the physical risk to a drive but will > clearly, as you state, facilitate backups (call it imaging if you like), > and limit risks of accidental deletions: directories can get easily > deleted, but partitions are not things you mess with on a daily basis. > > Finally, when something goes wrong when installing or uninstalling a > program, when a software crash happens, partitioning limits the extent > of the damage. > > I believe in having one partition for the OS, one for the programs, and > one for the data. > > The only draw back of partitioning is, first it requires a minimum of > understanding of what you are doing, and with Vista, the initial > partitioning can be difficult to modify. Second, it requires an > organized mind and some discipline to be of real benefit. > > Comparing the way people *organize* their garages will probably tell you > a lot about the way they store their data ... > Past experience with repeat customers, with little or no comprehension of file organization, restore points, or the ability to not open every email sent to their inbox, oh and a profound inability to comprehend that certain programs ( coffLimeWirecoff), are bad for your systems integrity, I have started setting users document files and settings on a separate partition. While this doesn't necessarily prevent that partition from infection or corruption, it does make my job easier in locating, isolating, and eliminating problems. I have come to the conclusion that instead of spending 5 minutes becoming educated about the mysteries of the magical internets box, would rather pay me $XX an hour to fix their problems every other month. While I'm not allergic to the income, it does tend to baffle me why certain people are comfortable shelling out that kind of money, when they really don't have to. I compare it to the way people maintain their cars. Some people take great care with their investment, while others couldn't care less where the oil goes, as long as the engine is still running.
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