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From: Brent on 4 Aug 2010 11:24
I was wondering if there is a good way to get the MAC address of my antenna
on my roof with software?

DETAILS:

Googling, I found Network Stumbler for Windows, which gave me a lot of
information about transmitting access points; but the antenna (which is a
receiver) wasn't on that list.

Trying to install airsnare screwed up on something called winpcap so that
failed (although if it's the right approach, I'll try again if you think it
will get the antenna address).

I even climbed on the roof to see if there was a sticker but the box (which
seems sealed) is so old any stickers are long gone from the elements.

The antenna has a line of sight connection to the ISP's antenna (but the
ISP support guy won't tell me the MAC address, only the last 6 digits). He
asked why I want to know, and, well, I just wanted to see if I can connect
to the antenna from a PC directly.

He told me to use a crossover cable, which worked fine connecting to the
antenna directly, but I want to try wireless and he said they don't support
that. But I don't see why I shouldn't be able to just change my MAC address
on the PC to connect directly to the beamed signal.

Here's the setup:
- ISP has a tower which my rooftop antenna is aimed at
- Rooftop antenna has a cable that enters the attic and ends on a box
- That box has a power supply connected, the one RJ45 input from the
antenna, and one RJ45 output
- When I connect a crossover cable to that RJ45 output, I'm on the net.
- When I connect a router to that RJ45 (via a normal cable), I'm on the
net.

All I want to do is use my PC to "emulate" the antenna (mostly to see if it
can be done but partially to get access on the property that's further from
the router).

I assume I can use a MAC address changer to emulate the antenna. I just
need to know the MAC address of the antenna. The ISP gave me the last few
digits but this is a technical question I haven't been able to answer by
googling.

QUESTION TO THE EXPERTS:
How could I get the MAC address of a rooftop antenna that I have wired
access to via an RJ45 output?
From: John Navas on 4 Aug 2010 11:49
On Wed, 4 Aug 2010 15:24:42 +0000 (UTC), in
<dc47f7d6a18af43e35dfadfa09f3959f(a)tioat.net>, Brent
<beemdoubleu(a)Use-Author-Supplied-Address.invalid> wrote:

>I was wondering if there is a good way to get the MAC address of my antenna
>on my roof with software?
>
>DETAILS:
>
>Googling, I found Network Stumbler for Windows, which gave me a lot of
>information about transmitting access points; but the antenna (which is a
>receiver) wasn't on that list.

That's probably because antennas do not have MAC addresses -- they don't
work at that level.

>Trying to install airsnare screwed up on something called winpcap so that
>failed (although if it's the right approach, I'll try again if you think it
>will get the antenna address).
>
>I even climbed on the roof to see if there was a sticker but the box (which
>seems sealed) is so old any stickers are long gone from the elements.

So it sounds like you have a >> Wireless Ethernet (client) bridge <<
connected to (built into) that antenna, which does have a MAC address,

>The antenna has a line of sight connection to the ISP's antenna (but the
>ISP support guy won't tell me the MAC address, only the last 6 digits). He
>asked why I want to know, and, well, I just wanted to see if I can connect
>to the antenna from a PC directly.
>
>He told me to use a crossover cable, which worked fine connecting to the
>antenna directly, but I want to try wireless and he said they don't support
>that. But I don't see why I shouldn't be able to just change my MAC address
>on the PC to connect directly to the beamed signal.

Why would you need to do that? Is the ISP filtering by MAC address?
What are you trying to do?

>Here's the setup:
>- ISP has a tower which my rooftop antenna is aimed at
>- Rooftop antenna has a cable that enters the attic and ends on a box
>- That box has a power supply connected, the one RJ45 input from the
>antenna, and one RJ45 output
>- When I connect a crossover cable to that RJ45 output, I'm on the net.
>- When I connect a router to that RJ45 (via a normal cable), I'm on the
>net.
>
>All I want to do is use my PC to "emulate" the antenna (mostly to see if it
>can be done

Your PC can't "emulate" an antenna -- it needs its own antenna to work
without the antenna and Wireless Ethernet (client) bridge. Is that what
you want? If so:
* Can your PC "see" the wireless access point of the ISP?
* If so, it should be able to connect if authorized by the ISP.
* If not, it probably doesn't have sufficient range (antenna gain).

>but partially to get access on the property that's further from
>the router).

By wire or wireless? If the latter, you need a wireless repeater.

>I assume I can use a MAC address changer to emulate the antenna. I just
>need to know the MAC address of the antenna. The ISP gave me the last few
>digits but this is a technical question I haven't been able to answer by
>googling.
>
>QUESTION TO THE EXPERTS:
>How could I get the MAC address of a rooftop antenna that I have wired
>access to via an RJ45 output?

You can't "emulate" the antenna. Can you be more clear about what you
want to do? See the wiki below for lots of helpful info.

--
John FAQ for Wireless Internet: <http://wireless.navas.us>
FAQ for Wi-Fi: <http://wireless.navas.us/wiki/Wi-Fi>
Wi-Fi How To: <http://wireless.navas.us/wiki/Wi-Fi_HowTo>
Fixes to Wi-Fi Problems: <http://wireless.navas.us/wiki/Wi-Fi_Fixes>
From: alexd on 4 Aug 2010 12:34
Meanwhile, at the alt.internet.wireless Job Justification Hearings, Brent
chose the tried and tested strategy of:

> I was wondering if there is a good way to get the MAC address of my
> antenna on my roof with software?

Kismet works for me, but I'm not about to explain to you how to install
linux. Actually someone suggested the Backtrack livecd other day; that might
be a better way to go if you can't find something on Windows that will show
MAC addresses of wireless devices it detects. So, switch it off, fire up
kismet, give it a couple of minutes to settle down and find everything else,
then switch it back on and whatever appears shortly afterwards is your
wireless "antenna", or as John said, wireless bridge. However, this assumes
it's a vanilla Wifi device, on the same band as your PC's wireless NIC.

> Googling, I found Network Stumbler for Windows, which gave me a lot of
> information about transmitting access points; but the antenna (which is a
> receiver) wasn't on that list.

Your post is shot through with misconceptions. The antenna doesn't have a
MAC address. The entire unit will be a wireless client bridge AKA subscriber
unit, of which the antenna is just one part. The wireless interface may have
a MAC address, the wired interface will have a MAC address. It's not
uncommon for the wired/wireless MAC addresses to be sequential, but it's not
mandatory. As for not transmitting, the unit wouldn't be much use if all it
did was receive, so I think it's safe to say it's a transmitter also.

> I even climbed on the roof to see if there was a sticker but the box
> (which seems sealed) is so old any stickers are long gone from the
> elements.

Someone might recognise it if you post a photo.

> The antenna has a line of sight connection to the ISP's antenna (but the
> ISP support guy won't tell me the MAC address, only the last 6 digits).

Ironic really, because that's the more unique part of the MAC address!

> He told me to use a crossover cable, which worked fine connecting to the
> antenna directly, but I want to try wireless and he said they don't
> support that. But I don't see why I shouldn't be able to just change my
> MAC address on the PC to connect directly to the beamed signal.

It may be 5GHz wifi. It may be wifi with some proprietary extensions. It may
use authentication, as well as encryption and being tied to the MAC address
of your subscriber unit. It may not even be wifi at all. In short, good
luck.

> All I want to do is use my PC to "emulate" the antenna (mostly to see if
> it can be done but partially to get access on the property that's further
> from the router).

Put your own access point on the LAN side of the router. You can then place
that wherever you want. Or just move the sub unit to where you need access.

--
<http://ale.cx/> (AIM:troffasky) (UnSoEsNpEaTm(a)ale.cx)
17:15:06 up 17 days, 7:46, 6 users, load average: 0.17, 0.32, 0.72
Qua illic est accuso, illic est a vindicatum

From: Jeff Liebermann on 4 Aug 2010 13:41
On Wed, 4 Aug 2010 15:24:42 +0000 (UTC), Brent
<beemdoubleu(a)Use-Author-Supplied-Address.invalid> wrote:

>I was wondering if there is a good way to get the MAC address of my antenna
>on my roof with software?

There are two MAC addresses up there. One if for the wireless
interface. The other is for the ethernet. They're usually one digit
apart. I assume you want the wireless. I'll also assume it's a
2.4GHz Wi-Fi radio, and not 5.7GHz or WiMax.

Since you already have the last 6 digits of the wireless interface,
the remaining 3 can be determined if you knew the manufacturer.
<http://www.coffer.com/mac_find/>

Since you can't open the box or pry the information out of your ISP,
it should be easy enough to just sniff some of the traffic from
wireless client bridge. Netstumbler should work if SSID broadcasting
is enabled. If you don't see anything, it's not.

Wireshark on the eithernet side should also work. Plug a PC into the
wireless client bridge and sniff any packets coming or going. The MAC
address should be in there somewhere.

>Trying to install airsnare screwed up on something called winpcap so that
>failed (although if it's the right approach, I'll try again if you think it
>will get the antenna address).

You need WinPcap installed and working to run most sniffers. Clean up
the mess, get the latest:
<http://www.winpcap.org/>
and try again.

>He
>asked why I want to know, and, well, I just wanted to see if I can connect
>to the antenna from a PC directly.

I presume you have a wired router connected via ethernet to the
wireless client bridge. Check your "WAN" settings on your unspecified
model router. If DHCP, then just use a crossover cable to connect. If
static IP addresses, write them down, plug them into the network
properties on the PC.

>He told me to use a crossover cable, which worked fine connecting to the
>antenna directly, but I want to try wireless and he said they don't support
>that.

It won't work with what you have. You'll need to add a wireless
access point or wireless router running on a different non-overlapping
channel (1, 6, or 11). Mount it away from the wireless client bridge
antenna on the roof as there may be mutual interference. This should
be a supported configuration, which your unspecified ISP should
support and provide some help. Using the wireless client bridge as a
repeater is a bad idea. If the box on the roof supports it, it will
also require configuration changes by the ISP. Two radios is easier
and better.

>But I don't see why I shouldn't be able to just change my MAC address
>on the PC to connect directly to the beamed signal.

You probably can do that if there's no additional security. The
problem is that the WISP probably wants some control over what signals
appear on his system. If every customer was able to add any RF
belching radio (such as the "high power" radios) on a system, it would
be very difficult to control. If all you want it access at different
points on the property, an added access point is easier and probably
better.

>QUESTION TO THE EXPERTS:
>How could I get the MAC address of a rooftop antenna that I have wired
>access to via an RJ45 output?

1. Sniff any traffic in or out of the ethernet port.
2. Use Kismet to sniff the wireless traffic.
3. Ask the ISP who made the radio board and lookup the MAC address
prefix.
4. Give up and add an access point.

--
Jeff Liebermann jeffl(a)cruzio.com
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558
From: Brent on 4 Aug 2010 13:48
On Wed, 04 Aug 2010 08:49:30 -0700, John Navas wrote:
> So it sounds like you have a >> Wireless Ethernet (client) bridge <<
> connected to (built into) that antenna, which does have a MAC address.

Hi John,

Thank you for clarifying. The "thing" (which I'll call a bridge
henceforth), is a box about a foot square and about 4 inches thick. It
definately has an ethernet address because the ISP support guy always finds
my "traffic" when I have problems by the last few digits of the MAC
address. He even told me those last few digits, but when I asked for the
rest, he didn't give that to me.

So I'll call it a bridge (with an antenna built in).

> Is the ISP filtering by MAC address?

I don't know. What I do know is that my antenna receives the signal from
their access point. I can easily 'see' their access point from my PC with
netstumbler (or even Windows WZC) when I connect with WZC directly to their
access point, a login web page comes up.

Note that there is no login web page when I connect to the RJ45 coming out
of the antenna/bridge that is on my roof.

> What are you trying to do?
I'm assuming if I emulate on the laptop the MAC address of the
antenna/bridge on the roof, then the laptop (I am hoping) can receive the
signals from the access point.

The advantages to me are:
a) It's interesting
b) I can be on the net far farther than my own router will broadcast
(Their access point signal is five bars all over my property while my own
router signal drops off drastically just fifty feet away from the house).

> Your PC can't "emulate" an antenna -- it needs its own antenna to work
> without the antenna and Wireless Ethernet (client) bridge. Is that what
> you want? If so:
> * Can your PC "see" the wireless access point of the ISP?

Yes. Even the Windows wireles zero application sees the access point;
netstumber sees even more of the provider's access points (they must have
redundancy). I don't know which access point my antenna/router is
connecting to, but, probably to the strongest signal.

> * If so, it should be able to connect if authorized by the ISP.

My router DOES connect so I'm authorized by my ISP. I know you guys are a
suspicious bunch, but, I just want to see if I can find the MAC address of
the ethernet card in that antenna box on the roof using software.

I directly asked the provider support guy who only gave me the last few
digits. Obviously they don't think I need to connect to their access point
directly (but they let me do that during my first month when I was having
problems so I KNOW it can be done. They asked me for my MAC address and
that allowed me to bypass the login screen they have when you connect to
the otherwise open access point).

That's why I know it will work; if only I could emulate the MAC address of
the ethernet card in the antenna box.

It's not a big deal if I can't; but it would be interesting to try.
All I need is a way to figure out the MAC address of that card (which is
probably why the support guy wouldn't give it to me).

> * If not, it probably doesn't have sufficient range (antenna gain).

I know I have sufficient range because the first month of my service I
connected directly to the access point after giving the ISP my MAC address
of my PC until they got the antenna/bridge working. After they got it
working, I just connect to the bridge using the router by cat-5 cable.

>>but partially to get access on the property that's further from
>>the router).
> By wire or wireless? If the latter, you need a wireless repeater.

By wire would be easy (but clumsy as all hell trying to string a 300 foot
cat5 cable around the property). :)

My interesting hypothesis is that if I can find the ethernet MAC address of
the bridge on my roof, I can try to connect directly to the access point
with the WZC on the laptop PC).

But, for that, I need to change my MAC address on the laptop to that of the
ethernet bridge on my roof.

That would be fun and interesting, but, it would entail knowing the MAC
address of the ethernet router on my roof. If there is no way to do that in
software, I'll just take the antenna/bridge apart (it's my property); but,
if there is a software way to find the ethernet address of that bridge on
my own network (albeit on the roof) ... that's what I'm looking for.

> You can't "emulate" the antenna. Can you be more clear about what you
> want to do?

I thought I was clear.

All I want to ask is HOW to get the MAC address of an ethernet bridge which
is sitting on my roof and connected to my network by wire to my router.

Does anyone know HOW do to that in software? (I presume there is a sticker
on the board inside that box on the roof; but that's my method of last
resort.)
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