From: CM on
On Jul 4, 7:14 pm, Terry Reedy <tjre...(a)udel.edu> wrote:
>

I think there's a good point to Python 3 put-downs (if I take put-down
to mean generally reasonable criticism, which is what I've read here
recently, and not trolling). And that is simply to register
dissent.

Any online group is an opportunity to register dissent in a way that
is public, open, immediate, interactive, and will (probably) be
preserved for historians to check. The fact is, some people have
gripes with Python 3; they are letting it be known. If no one did,
there could be no later time at which people could look back and know
what the reaction was to its introduction--it would just be a blank.
Aren't opinions that dissent from the prevailing ones important to
register, whether one thinks they are right or wrong?

Che
From: Antoine Pitrou on
On Sun, 4 Jul 2010 18:20:38 -0700 (PDT)
CM <cmpython(a)gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Any online group is an opportunity to register dissent in a way that
> is public, open, immediate, interactive, and will (probably) be
> preserved for historians to check. The fact is, some people have
> gripes with Python 3; they are letting it be known. If no one did,
> there could be no later time at which people could look back and know
> what the reaction was to its introduction--it would just be a blank.
> Aren't opinions that dissent from the prevailing ones important to
> register, whether one thinks they are right or wrong?

Sure. As long as you don't record the same dissent from the same person
ten times in a row. Then it becomes trolling.



From: Gregor Horvath on
Am Sun, 04 Jul 2010 18:51:54 -0500
schrieb Tim Chase <python.list(a)tim.thechases.com>:

> I think it's the same venting of frustration that caused veteran
> VB6 developers to start calling VB.Net "Visual Fred" -- the
> language was too different and too non-backwards-compatible.
>

VB6 -> VB.NET and Python 2 -> 3 is not a valid comparison.

VB6 and VB.NET are totally different languages and technologies, with
some similarity in syntax. This is not true for Python 2->3.
This is an healthy organic language growth, not an abandon of a
language.

--
Greg

From: Roy Smith on
In article <mailman.247.1278309447.1673.python-list(a)python.org>,
Dennis Lee Bieber <wlfraed(a)ix.netcom.com> wrote:

> On Sun, 04 Jul 2010 20:05:03 -0400, Roy Smith <roy(a)panix.com> declaimed
> the following in gmane.comp.python.general:
>
> > In article <mailman.238.1278287528.1673.python-list(a)python.org>,
> > Tim Chase <python.list(a)tim.thechases.com> wrote:
> >
> > > I've often wondered if changing the name of the language (such as
> > > "Adder", "Served", "Dwarf" or "Fawlty" for the Britcom fans in
> > > the crowd) would have mitigated some of the more vituperative
> > > slurs on what became Py3, designating a shared legacy without the
> > > expectation of 100% backwards-compatibility.
> >
> > Maybe it should have been "Python five, no, THREE!"
>
> But Adder works on two levels... The BritCom, and the serpentine...

Not to mention that the same main characters show up in each version :-)
From: Terry Reedy on
On 7/4/2010 9:20 PM, CM wrote:
> On Jul 4, 7:14 pm, Terry Reedy<tjre...(a)udel.edu> wrote:
>>
>
> I think there's a good point to Python 3 put-downs (if I take put-down
> to mean generally reasonable criticism, which is what I've read here
> recently, and not trolling). And that is simply to register
> dissent.

But dissent from what?

Dissent from something obviously true?
(like 'Pythonx.y is useful to some people')

Dissent from something obvious false, that no one has said?
(like 'Everyone should switch to Pythonx.y')

> Any online group is an opportunity to register dissent in a way that
> is public, open, immediate, interactive, and will (probably) be
> preserved for historians to check. The fact is, some people have
> gripes with Python 3; they are letting it be known.

I have several 'gripes' with 2.7 and it is currently useless to me.
Should I let them be known? How many times?

> If no one did,
> there could be no later time at which people could look back and know
> what the reaction was to its introduction--it would just be a blank.
> Aren't opinions that dissent from the prevailing ones important to
> register, whether one thinks they are right or wrong?

Do you agree with me that the same criteria for gripe legitimacy should
be applied equally to all Python versions (even if we should disagree on
what those criteria should be)?

--
Terry Jan Reedy