From: jason hirsh on

On Aug 13, 2010, at 2:14 PM, Larry Stone wrote:

> On Fri, 13 Aug 2010, jason hirsh wrote:
>> when I stop debugging I won't this is the third instance of I
>> have had of "lost mail" and teh first that I had the address so I
>> can chase it down
> You didn't lose any mail. The upstream server did. You can't fix
> other server's problems and until you accept the mail (you didn't),
> it's not yours to lose.

well when is it acceptance for a contract offer , it is kind of har to
say.. hey the guy that wants to spend the money has a crappy server

teh client would rather sort through spam then not receive email

>> The sender said to my client that he sent the message .. he was
>> unaware it was rejected
>> I would like to reject it back to the sender so he knows..
> You did reject it. Notification is the job of the last MTA to accept
> the message. A rejecting MTA cannot provide any notification back to
> the sender without it being at serious risk of being a backscatter
> source.

Ok that makes sense, doesn't sell well, but it makes perfect semse

> That the upstream MTA failed to properly notify the sender is not,
> let me make that clear, IS NOT your problem to solve. If the sender
> is complaining to you, you need to tell him or her that your system
> rejected the message (which is your right) and that failure to
> notify him or her of the rejection is a failure by a server not
> under your control. He needs to complain to his provider as to why
> the upstream server (most likely the one he is sending via or if
> not, very near it) is not properly notifying him.
>> if I can't notify senders of rejects it sure beats searching logs
>> for rejects
> Are you new to this? Because given the level of spam and other crud
> on the Internet, with any kind of anti-spam/anti-virus controls in
> place, you should be (or soon will be) rejecting hundreds if not
> thousands of messages per day.

No I am not mew.. but this is a new problem .. legitimate email being
bounced I have a small customer bases.. 5 domains less then 20
active accounts ..but I wouldn't place the host name rejection
messages at only a couple of hundred a day the vast majority are
for other reasons and from other filters those I don't care about

> -- Larry Stone
> lstone19(a)