The Register: Reding would OK charges to receive mobile calls
in [UK Mobile]
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From: Brian A on 17 Jun 2008 07:27 http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/06/16/reding_charges/ I checked out a typical US plan, on Verizon, from a NYC, Brooklyn base (they ask for your location). This package appears to offer unlimited NATIONAL incoming calls. So, presumably, they mask these charges by selling a low amount of cheap cost outgoing minutes at a very much inflated price. I wonder if the 'unlimited' is the same as the UK 'unlimited' which means you are, in reality, limited and we'll charge you a fat fee if you go over our small print 'fair use' amount. http://tinyurl.com/6zbumh The inclusive 'free', or subsidised price, phone model appears to be operative in the US, also, if this is anything to go by. --- Remove 'no_spam_' from email address. ---
From: Graham. on 17 Jun 2008 09:38 Silly me, I read that as *Reading* -- Graham %Profound_observation%
From: Dennis Ferguson on 17 Jun 2008 15:53 On 2008-06-17, Brian A <no_spam_bca1000(a)hotmail.com> wrote: > http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/06/16/reding_charges/ > > I checked out a typical US plan, on Verizon, from a NYC, Brooklyn base > (they ask for your location). > This package appears to offer unlimited NATIONAL incoming calls. So, > presumably, they mask these charges by selling a low amount of cheap > cost outgoing minutes at a very much inflated price. I wonder if the > 'unlimited' is the same as the UK 'unlimited' which means you are, in > reality, limited and we'll charge you a fat fee if you go over our > small print 'fair use' amount. > http://tinyurl.com/6zbumh I'm not quite sure where you are seeing "unlimited incoming calls" there. Note that "National IN calling" isn't incoming calls, it is what they call Verizon-mobile-to-Verizon-mobile calls. Arbitrary incoming calls consume plan minutes just like arbitrary outgoing calls do, but calls to or from Verizon mobiles don't. Note that "unlimited" in the US pretty much always means the ordinary meaning of the word "unlimited"; there has been some litigation there which has strongly discouraged the UK-style use of the word. While you might find some wording in the Verizon customer agreement which limits you somewhat when roaming (even the big carriers, like Verizon, have lots of coverage holes in more rural parts of the country which they fill in with national roaming on other operators), "unlimited" really does mean you can use your phone as much as you want on the home network. I'd also note that Verizon is hardly "typical", in fact Verizon's reputation is that they provide the best coverage where they operate at the highest prices. If you want to see what the other end of the feeding chain looks like you might look at, say, MetroPCS at http://www.metropcs.com/ There you can have unlimited calling for a $40/month flat rate. Mobile phone service in the US isn't really cheaper than the UK (in fact I think the big American mobile companies have a significantly higher ARPU than UK companies do, the former are extremely good at extracting cash from their customers), but if you measure everything in cost-per-minute it can be very cheap in the US to use your mobile a lot. And since intercarrier call termination charges in the US are very close to zero the carriers have a lot of lattitude to compete on price. > The inclusive 'free', or subsidised price, phone model appears to be > operative in the US, also, if this is anything to go by. This part is very true. I would point out another difference between the US and UK, however, that being that US service contracts can generally be terminated at any time by the payment of an Early Termination Fee, which tends to be in the $150-$200 range. That tends to limit the phone subsidies to $150-$200. Dennis Ferguson
From: R. Mark Clayton on 17 Jun 2008 21:19 "Brian A" <no_spam_bca1000(a)hotmail.com> wrote in message news:n76f545uoj72vr1bctsakog0oh24g909t7(a)4ax.com... > http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/06/16/reding_charges/ > > I checked out a typical US plan, on Verizon, from a NYC, Brooklyn base > (they ask for your location). > This package appears to offer unlimited NATIONAL incoming calls. So, > presumably, they mask these charges by selling a low amount of cheap > cost outgoing minutes at a very much inflated price. I wonder if the > 'unlimited' is the same as the UK 'unlimited' which means you are, in > reality, limited and we'll charge you a fat fee if you go over our > small print 'fair use' amount. > http://tinyurl.com/6zbumh > The inclusive 'free', or subsidised price, phone model appears to be > operative in the US, also, if this is anything to go by. What are you talking about. Within the UK all networks have free incoming calls, and I have never heard of a limit. If you go abroad then incoming calls are normally charged (often heavily). This is because the model differs between the UK and US. In the US numbers appear in NANP and are indistinguishable from landlines. The extra cost of the mobile segment falls on the called party. OTOH in the UK mobile numbers have their own ranges and charges fall on the caller.
From: Brian A on 18 Jun 2008 06:36
On Wed, 18 Jun 2008 02:19:50 +0100, "R. Mark Clayton" <nospamclayton(a)btinternet.com> wrote: Firstly, thank you Dennis for clearing up some points - particularly re the incoming calls only being unlimited on v to v and that others are taken out of minutes. I am only approaching this for the first time. I wanted to see what sort of model existed in th eUS so that I could decide whether I was in agreement with the possible change or against it. I wanted to spark a debate in order to glean more information. > >"Brian A" <no_spam_bca1000(a)hotmail.com> wrote in message >news:n76f545uoj72vr1bctsakog0oh24g909t7(a)4ax.com... >> http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/06/16/reding_charges/ >> >> I checked out a typical US plan, on Verizon, from a NYC, Brooklyn base >> (they ask for your location). >> This package appears to offer unlimited NATIONAL incoming calls. So, >> presumably, they mask these charges by selling a low amount of cheap >> cost outgoing minutes at a very much inflated price. I wonder if the >> 'unlimited' is the same as the UK 'unlimited' which means you are, in >> reality, limited and we'll charge you a fat fee if you go over our >> small print 'fair use' amount. >> http://tinyurl.com/6zbumh >> The inclusive 'free', or subsidised price, phone model appears to be >> operative in the US, also, if this is anything to go by. > >What are you talking about. Within the UK all networks have free incoming >calls, and I have never heard of a limit. If you go abroad then incoming >calls are normally charged (often heavily). I am sure that it is agreed that incoming calls are free on all UK networks. The comments made, which perhaps may have created confusion, was to the term 'unlimited'. It was not meant to relect on incoming minutes in the UK as under current regimes. The term 'unlimited' has been used, in the UK, when in fact a limit exists in the small print. I am of the opinion that the mobile companies are allowed to get away with this, by Ofcom, because of the amount of money they paid for 3G licences. Any organisation worth its salt would have pounced on the likes of Vodafone (offering, I think, some miniscule amount like 250MB as 'unlimited' ). Personally, if vodafone sent me an inflated bill under that regime I'd refuse to pay it. Let a court decide what is reasonable for a customer to assume by the term 'unlimited'. They are, IMHO, just out to fleece thier customers. > >This is because the model differs between the UK and US. In the US numbers >appear in NANP and are indistinguishable from landlines. The extra cost of >the mobile segment falls on the called party. OTOH in the UK mobile numbers >have their own ranges and charges fall on the caller. I think that if we were to pay for incoming calls then restrictions on 'cold calling' must be very strictly applied. Who wants to waste mobile minutes talking to someone trying to sell you a mobile phone contract etc. It should also be possible to restrict international incoming calls to a white list. That way call centres from abroad can't get round the restrictions as easily. --- Remove 'no_spam_' from email address. --- |