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From: TeGGeR? on 17 Nov 2005 18:25
w_tom <w_tom1(a)hotmail.com> wrote in news:437CF6FB.918898A5(a)hotmail.com:

> 'How' is necessary to answer your question. Without how,
> then no respondant has sufficient information. The above
> answer goes even farther. It lists specific components that
> were probably in that electrical path.



Not hard to figure out, I'd think. Power supply, motherboard, PCI bus,
associated miscellanea.



> This from someone who
> literally takes lightning damaged parts, identifies the
> damaged components, replaces those components, and uses the
> now repaired part for years without failure.



And you can't tell me how likely it is that the damage goes past the power
supply, and how often you see the PCI bus damaged through the modem when
the modem has another device between it and the wall?

You must see patterns in your work, surely?



> You will not get
> a better source for your answer. It is the best answer
> available since the newsgroup was provided minimal
> information.
>
> Another answer is speculation - try this and try that.



I am in the middle of disassembling the laptop. Just for fun, of course,
since I know next to nothing about laptops and wish to learn what I can
from the cadaver. I am currently confounded by tiny Torx screws that hold
the power supply in place. They are of a size my local hardware store does
not stock. 10? 5? I only have a driver as small as 15.



> It
> could be this or it could be that. When done, you might
> replace half the machine and still not have a working laptop.
> Without HOW, then no one can answer WHAT.


It will remain unworking. My current project is to hook the now excised
hard drive up to a desktop (with the appropriate adapter of course) to see
if it can be read, in order to recover such data as may be recovered.

Thanks for your help.


--
TeGGeR?

The Unofficial Honda/Acura FAQ
www.tegger.com/hondafaq/
From: kony on 17 Nov 2005 19:13
On 17 Nov 2005 23:25:03 GMT, "TeGGeR?" <tegger(a)tegger.c0m>
wrote:

>w_tom <w_tom1(a)hotmail.com> wrote in news:437CF6FB.918898A5(a)hotmail.com:
>
>> 'How' is necessary to answer your question. Without how,
>> then no respondant has sufficient information. The above
>> answer goes even farther. It lists specific components that
>> were probably in that electrical path.
>
>
>
>Not hard to figure out, I'd think. Power supply, motherboard, PCI bus,
>associated miscellanea.

If it weren't, you'd already know, yes?

It can travel arcross many areas, but the magnitude and
duration may determine what damage was actually done, as
well as the specific design this particular system had. We
cannot supply some kind of cheat-sheet that would apply to
one specific system as a rule.

You should test the internal power board. If it works,
replace the motherboard. If it doesn't, replace it, then
test the motherboard (try whole system). At that point you
will have a laborious process of testing every minute detail
of system operation.


There is no shortcut, no use in presumptions about limit to
damages... whole thing needs checked in a systematic fashion
from a stripped-down and then gradually re-integrated (parts
readded) state.

From: Barry Watzman on 17 Nov 2005 20:22
It might be more useful to suggest what might not be damaged that still
has resale value:

-Keyboard
-Hard drive (maybe)
-LCD panel (maybe)
-Inverter (maybe)
-Optical drive (maybe)
-Battery
-Case and Plastics

If the hard drive is ok, then probably so is the LCD panel and the
optical drive. That would probably suggest that the surge didn't get
beyond the motherboard.


TeGGeR? wrote:

> I've been given a Toshiba Satellite A30 laptop that was damaged when a
> lightning bolt hit someone's house. This thing was plugged into a DSL modem
> and the 110V wall outlet. There was a cheap "surge suppressor" in the line
> from the wall.
>
> I've already determined that the power transfromer (the thing that converts
> 110VAC to 19VDC) is dead. When a good transformer is plugged in, the smell
> of magic smoke is immediately evident. There is no sign of activity from
> the laptop.
>
> The owner has decided to buy a new laptop, and I've been given this one
> just in case it can be made to work again.
>
> So, my questions: Based on the description above, is there any way to
> predict how far in the power spike went? What's most likely to be damaged?
>
From: w_tom on 18 Nov 2005 00:35
To take what Kony has posted farther. Unlike desktop
computers, laptops are more uniquely designed. What happened
to that Toshiba requires details not provided here. And so
you were provided a probably path of destruction; incomong in
AC mains and outgoing on DSL port. Using that, you now have a
first path to look for an incoming / outgoing path.

Computers already have internal protection. For example,
galvanic protection inside the power supply had to be
overwhelmed to have suffered damage. OK. But still the reason
why it was overwhelmed - what the transient was seeking - also
helps to identify what may be damaged in that power supply and
on various boards inside the laptop.

Your list of suspects assumed something is damaged when
transient is only incoming. For example, why would PCI bus or
motherboard be damaged? In desktop machines, ae modem is
often damaged by a transient from AC mains. To get to modem,
the transient used PCI bus connector and motherboard traces.
And yet no damage to PCI bus electronics nor motherboard
occurs. Again, if we follow the path through that desktop
machine, then path through PCI bus and motherboard does not
pass through any electronics. It would be extremely
difficult, using your assumptions, to discover what was and
was not damaged.

Don't think for one minute that you will see a damaged
part. Most damaged devices have no external indication. Just
another reason why it is so helpful to know what the outgoing
transient path was. Of course, little will be learned without
a volt meter. One of the first things to test is power from
battery, through power supply board, to computer. Where does
voltage exist and not exist? Your eyes will not see damage.
To see damage means eyes that can see those details. The best
tool per dollar is a 3.5 digit multimeter.

Dissembling is how one learns. One never saves money by
repairing things. But the value is obtained in doing the work
- and learning.

Torx is another example. #10 Torx is a most common size
that any properly stocked hardware store should carry. Even
Sears carries torx drivers (last I saw before the latest
restructuring) of even odder sizes such as 8 and 9.

"TeGGeR?" wrote:
> w_tom <w_tom1(a)hotmail.com> wrote in news:437CF6FB.918898A5(a)hotmail.com:
>> 'How' is necessary to answer your question. Without how,
>> then no respondant has sufficient information. The above
>> answer goes even farther. It lists specific components that
>> were probably in that electrical path.
>
> Not hard to figure out, I'd think. Power supply, motherboard, PCI
> bus, associated miscellanea.
> ...
>
> And you can't tell me how likely it is that the damage goes past
> the power supply, and how often you see the PCI bus damaged
> through the modem when the modem has another device between it
> and the wall?
>
> You must see patterns in your work, surely?
> ...
>
> I am in the middle of disassembling the laptop. Just for fun, of
> course, since I know next to nothing about laptops and wish to
> learn what I can from the cadaver. I am currently confounded by
> tiny Torx screws that hold the power supply in place. They are of
> a size my local hardware store does not stock. 10? 5? I only have
> a driver as small as 15.
> ...
>
> It will remain unworking. My current project is to hook the now
> excised hard drive up to a desktop (with the appropriate adapter
> of course) to see if it can be read, in order to recover such
> data as may be recovered.
From: TeGGeR? on 21 Nov 2005 08:32
kony <spam(a)spam.com> wrote in
news:8t6qn1l6jgiahee0nrv66rrhj8d9imu0ck(a)4ax.com:

> On 17 Nov 2005 23:25:03 GMT, "TeGGeR?" <tegger(a)tegger.c0m>
> wrote:
>
>>w_tom <w_tom1(a)hotmail.com> wrote in news:437CF6FB.918898A5(a)hotmail.com:
>>
>>> 'How' is necessary to answer your question. Without how,
>>> then no respondant has sufficient information. The above
>>> answer goes even farther. It lists specific components that
>>> were probably in that electrical path.
>>
>>
>>
>>Not hard to figure out, I'd think. Power supply, motherboard, PCI bus,
>>associated miscellanea.
>
> If it weren't, you'd already know, yes?




It looks like the hard drive is OK. I was able to read it on a desktop and
extract the necessary files.



>
> It can travel arcross many areas, but the magnitude and
> duration may determine what damage was actually done, as
> well as the specific design this particular system had. We
> cannot supply some kind of cheat-sheet that would apply to
> one specific system as a rule.
>
> You should test the internal power board. If it works,
> replace the motherboard.



I need to get my hands on a power board first.




> If it doesn't, replace it, then
> test the motherboard (try whole system). At that point you
> will have a laborious process of testing every minute detail
> of system operation.
>
>
> There is no shortcut, no use in presumptions about limit to
> damages... whole thing needs checked in a systematic fashion
> from a stripped-down and then gradually re-integrated (parts
> readded) state.
>


Once I find a power board, I can do that.



--
TeGGeR?

The Unofficial Honda/Acura FAQ
www.tegger.com/hondafaq/
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