Use Case Point Estimation
in [OOP]
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From: AndyW on 25 Sep 2005 03:21 On Sat, 24 Sep 2005 18:33:52 -0700, "Nick Malik [Microsoft]" <nickmalik(a)hotmail.nospam.com> wrote: > >>>> I dont think anyone in any industry would volunteer to do work without >>>> knowing what it is first. >>> >>>Unfortunatelly in the part of world I currently live in, it is a common >>>practice. The contract is normally based on very incomplete >>>information, thus the second option is usually not possible until after >>>you start working on it. >> >> No Analysis :( >> . > >Hi Andy, > >Perhaps you are not familiar with the context in which Tom is writing. If I >understand correctly, he is involved in a consulting organization that bids >on RFPs. The orgs that bid on RFPs are unique companies (or branches of a >company). They have to be. The process demands it. > Yep, I'm familiar with it (I hope) - years ago the US and UK governments used to require formal methods such as SSADM and before ISO, there were the mil standards (think they still do use ssadm from memory). What they are testing for is to see if you have the capability to do the job rather than being the cheapest. In otherwords, if you have built that software several times before, then your metrics will be very accurate, your risks will also be very low and very well defined and your costs will be well summarised and likely within the budget range of the RFP, and your quality will be very high (and probably well known). The problem is how do you get the experience without the contracts and how do you get the contracts without the experience. There are two solutions to the problem - guess (use mathmatics to make it seem accurate) and use experience. I find the latter is probably the better track to go down and it comes down to organisational maturity. If your organisation has been in the business for a while and is mature, then it can draw on its metrics (experience) from working in other similar sectors. If the org. is new to the sector, then its only option probably will be to guess until it gains some experience. The trick is to work as a 'learning organisation' and continuously develop and improve the procedures that can help you develop accurate information over time. It may not be useful now, but eventually it will be. This kind of bidding is common in the services industry - now the domain of IBM and HP. I've seen them put great sales pitches in, but still lose the contract because they were not accurate at demonstrating capability (it does show in the tender documentation). The RFP business is also very political and nightmarish, there is all that business with partnering, suppliers, marketing relationships etc. Mind you, I especially like those tenders where they wheel in boxes of documents (you know those boxes that photocopier paper is delivered in).
From: Nick Malik [Microsoft] on 26 Sep 2005 13:45
Hi Andy, > What they are testing for is to see if you have the capability to do > the job rather than being the cheapest. You are assuming organizational maturity on the part of the purchaser. You may be a bit optimistic :-). In my experience, they had no idea what to look for. > The problem is how do you get the experience without the contracts and > how do you get the contracts without the experience. > > There are two solutions to the problem - guess (use mathmatics to make > it seem accurate) and use experience. I find the latter is probably > the better track to go down and it comes down to organisational > maturity. If your organisation has been in the business for a while > and is mature, then it can draw on its metrics (experience) from > working in other similar sectors. If the org. is new to the sector, > then its only option probably will be to guess until it gains some > experience. I disagree with the last sentence. If the org is new to the sector, it can use the statistics from other orgs in the sector to give it an edge on the RFPs. One of the things that I find continuously odd is that orgs that have been around for years will have detailed information available to them, but they won't use it. While new orgs, that are smart, can use that information to outbid the better established companies. Accuracy matters, and accuracy from experience, where experience led to measurement, and the measures were published, is a great way to win. > > The trick is to work as a 'learning organisation' and continuously > develop and improve the procedures that can help you develop accurate > information over time. It may not be useful now, but eventually it > will be. we agree on this point and, pretty much, the rest of your reply. The question that I asked still stands. What mechanism of measurement do you use to get your accuracy on RFP to 90%? -- --- Nick Malik [Microsoft] MCSD, CFPS, Certified Scrummaster http://blogs.msdn.com/nickmalik Disclaimer: Opinions expressed in this forum are my own, and not representative of my employer. I do not answer questions on behalf of my employer. I'm just a programmer helping programmers. -- |