paranoid ?
in [ASM]
|
From: Rod Pemberton on 17 Jan 2008 11:06 "Robert Redelmeier" <redelm(a)ev1.net.invalid> wrote in message news:uvojj.63614$eY.35560(a)newssvr13.news.prodigy.net... > I say nothing of the sort except wrt aircraft, and I'm not > sure even then. CCL (concealed-carry licence) holders could > be trusted, but would probably have to be constantly reminded > to switch to frangible ammo. > Why do you say that? Injury to other passengers? No more so than those injured from "bump and roll"... We're not talking massive over penetration from rifle rounds. What's the need for frangibles? To protect the electronics? To protect the property, i.e., airplane? Surely not to protect the, likely vested, hijackers... unless you are talking rifle rounds to "pop" the vest. The plane is not going to explode if punctured. Even non-scientific tests, aka Myth Busters, has concluded puncturing the airplane while under pressure is a non-issue: small hole, large leak, no rips, no boom, no structural failure... Rod Pemberton
From: Evenbit on 18 Jan 2008 14:54 On Jan 14, 12:02 pm, "Rod Pemberton" <do_not_h...(a)nohavenot.cmm> wrote: > > I never said they were efficient. Only that paranoid fears of our > government have come true. Mass rebellion is probably a likely reason > though... If one ignores the massive purchases of guns by white rural > Christians in the Bible belt, after the slaughter of Christians in Waco by > our government... And who is our government worried about? Muslims... not > Christians... Hmm? You have any data to support that it was a Christian-led purchase increase? The increase was mainly due to new regulations banning the import of certain types of guns, magazines, etc. People who had already planned on (possible) future purchases decided buy the stuff before the new regs took effect. Christians (like all the other religions) are inherently pacifists. "turn the other cheak" On the other hand, I suppose a certain segment of them can become "radicalized" just as easily as a certain segment of Muslims who become "radicalized" and rain terror upon their perceived enemy. Nathan.
From: Evenbit on 18 Jan 2008 15:04 On Jan 16, 4:27 am, "Rod Pemberton" <do_not_h...(a)nohavenot.cmm> wrote: > > > weapons require training > > Are you saying the simple items I listed require training? More than a fire > extinguisher? More than a frisbee? More than a baseball dunk tank at the > amusement park? More than flare gun? More than a BB gun? More than a > pellet gun at the amusement park? More than a .22 rifle? More than sling > shot? More than a "spit-wad" through a straw? More than a basketball? > > At 12, was your environment devoid of all sports, all physical activity? Do > you think people get training for mace, pepper spray, club, or flare gun? > I'd say a large percentage of the US population (urban and rural, not really > suburban) learns how to shoot before they learn how to drive... and they > learn to drive before they can get a license. Although my immediate family > didn't use guns, I'm pretty sure all of my relatives, and I've got thousands > of them - maybe tens of, learned to shoot between 8 and 15. Many relatives > on one side were trained with 12 Ga's at that age. Same here. But rifles and shotguns are all-together a world-apart from trying to hit a target using a powerful handgun. An un-trained 12-year old (or adult) is very likely to miss the target using a .45, even at close range. Nathan.
From: Robert Redelmeier on 18 Jan 2008 20:34 Rod Pemberton <do_not_have(a)nohavenot.cmm> wrote in part: > > "Robert Redelmeier" <redelm(a)ev1.net.invalid> wrote in message >> I say nothing of the sort except wrt aircraft, and I'm not >> sure even then. CCL (concealed-carry licence) holders could >> be trusted, but would probably have to be constantly reminded >> to switch to frangible ammo. > The plane is not going to explode if punctured. Even > non-scientific tests, aka Myth Busters, has concluded puncturing > the airplane while under pressure is a non-issue: small hole, > large leak, no rips, no boom, no structural failure... Only for fairly small round holes. Misses likely would hit the pressure hull at a much shallower angle, resulting in a longer tear and potential hoop failure, especially in the fatigued aluminum you perviously mentioned. At least one aircraft has suffered such a failure in flight without the hole. -- Robert
From: Rod Pemberton on 18 Jan 2008 21:25
"Evenbit" <nbaker2328(a)charter.net> wrote in message news:8768c2ea-2562-43bd-8906-ba29953e8b2c(a)v17g2000hsa.googlegroups.com... > On Jan 16, 4:27 am, "Rod Pemberton" <do_not_h...(a)nohavenot.cmm> wrote: > > > > > weapons require training > > > > Are you saying the simple items I listed require training? More than a fire > > extinguisher? More than a frisbee? More than a baseball dunk tank at the > > amusement park? More than flare gun? More than a BB gun? More than a > > pellet gun at the amusement park? More than a .22 rifle? More than sling > > shot? More than a "spit-wad" through a straw? More than a basketball? > > > > At 12, was your environment devoid of all sports, all physical activity? Do > > you think people get training for mace, pepper spray, club, or flare gun? > > I'd say a large percentage of the US population (urban and rural, not really > > suburban) learns how to shoot before they learn how to drive... and they > > learn to drive before they can get a license. Although my immediate family > > didn't use guns, I'm pretty sure all of my relatives, and I've got thousands > > of them - maybe tens of, learned to shoot between 8 and 15. Many relatives > > on one side were trained with 12 Ga's at that age. > > Same here. But rifles and shotguns are all-together a world-apart > from trying to hit a target using a powerful handgun. An un-trained > 12-year old (or adult) is very likely to miss the target using a .45, > even at close range. > I agree. Why does everyone seem to think I mentioned a .45? Now, I'm really getting paranoid of you guys. RP: There's no reason why an airplane couldn't have 20 of them on random isles (to prevent control of them) with a mix non-lethal weapons: single discharge taser, mace or pepper spray, billy club, beanbag gun: a single shot, pistol sized, short-barrelled shotgun. RP: That's why I didn't list a single shot .45 ACP, or an incidiary, etc. because of difficulty of use, required aim, richochet, overpenetration. Rod Pemberton |