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From: Julio Cesar Covolato on 7 Aug 2010 01:37
Hi!

Is there anyone using postfix in cloud, like Amazon ec2?

My questions:
Is this interesting?
The pros and cons..
Other clound sistem...
Why and why not to cloud postfix.

Anyone?

--
-----------------------------
_ Julio Cesar Covolato
0v0 <julio(a)psi.com.br>
/(_)\ F: 55-11-3129-3366
^ ^ PSI INTERNET
-----------------------------

From: Stan Hoeppner on 7 Aug 2010 05:15
Julio Cesar Covolato put forth on 8/7/2010 12:37 AM:

> Is there anyone using postfix in cloud, like Amazon ec2?

Dunno about Postfix specifically, but there are/were many spammers operating
out of the Amazon cloud as well as the Rackspace cloud. Even if they are
clean now, their reputation is still low due to prior traffic.

> My questions:
> Is this interesting?
> The pros and cons..
> Other clound sistem...
> Why and why not to cloud postfix.
>
> Anyone?

No pros, only cons. TINW wholesale block SMTP from Amazon's cloud,
Rackspace's cloud, etc. Mail emitted from clouds and VPS servers at cheap
ISPs has a much higher chance of being blocked, delayed, etc than that from a
colo'd box at a reputable provider.

Due to the pricing structure of cloud and VPS services they are both
attractive to spammers, and the spammers care not if they cause the netblocks
they use to be scorched. They simply then move on to another VPS provider in
search of "clean" cloud/VPS netblocks to spam from.

Clouds and VPS are fine for a few classes of applications. SMTP mail is not
one of them.

--
Stan

From: Jonathan Tripathy on 7 Aug 2010 09:09

On 07/08/10 10:15, Stan Hoeppner wrote:
> Julio Cesar Covolato put forth on 8/7/2010 12:37 AM:
>
>
>> Is there anyone using postfix in cloud, like Amazon ec2?
>>
> Dunno about Postfix specifically, but there are/were many spammers operating
> out of the Amazon cloud as well as the Rackspace cloud. Even if they are
> clean now, their reputation is still low due to prior traffic.
>
>
>> My questions:
>> Is this interesting?
>> The pros and cons..
>> Other clound sistem...
>> Why and why not to cloud postfix.
>>
>> Anyone?
>>
> No pros, only cons. TINW wholesale block SMTP from Amazon's cloud,
> Rackspace's cloud, etc. Mail emitted from clouds and VPS servers at cheap
> ISPs has a much higher chance of being blocked, delayed, etc than that from a
> colo'd box at a reputable provider.
>
> Due to the pricing structure of cloud and VPS services they are both
> attractive to spammers, and the spammers care not if they cause the netblocks
> they use to be scorched. They simply then move on to another VPS provider in
> search of "clean" cloud/VPS netblocks to spam from.
>
> Clouds and VPS are fine for a few classes of applications. SMTP mail is not
> one of them.
>
>

There is nothing wrong with using Postfix on a VPS. Works great. Been
using it for ages. Companies that block whole netblock of VPS ISP are
being a bit silly, as VPS are becoming used more and more for
businesses. Of course, VPS ISPs should always do checks to make sure
that a person signing up is who they say they are - A simple credit card
name and address would suffice I guess.

From: "Mark Scholten" on 7 Aug 2010 09:19


> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-postfix-users(a)postfix.org [mailto:owner-postfix-
> users(a)postfix.org] On Behalf Of Stan Hoeppner
> Sent: Saturday, August 07, 2010 11:15 AM
> To: postfix-users(a)postfix.org
> Subject: Re: Postfix on Cloud
>
> Julio Cesar Covolato put forth on 8/7/2010 12:37 AM:
>
> > Is there anyone using postfix in cloud, like Amazon ec2?
>
> Dunno about Postfix specifically, but there are/were many spammers
> operating
> out of the Amazon cloud as well as the Rackspace cloud. Even if they
> are
> clean now, their reputation is still low due to prior traffic.
>
> > My questions:
> > Is this interesting?
> > The pros and cons..
> > Other clound sistem...
> > Why and why not to cloud postfix.
> >
> > Anyone?
>
> No pros, only cons. TINW wholesale block SMTP from Amazon's cloud,
> Rackspace's cloud, etc. Mail emitted from clouds and VPS servers at
> cheap
> ISPs has a much higher chance of being blocked, delayed, etc than that
> from a
> colo'd box at a reputable provider.

If you take a good VPS provider there is no difference between sending it
from a VPS compared to sending it from a colo'd/dedicated box. The most
important thing is that they have to be reputable (provider, network and
range). A good VPS provider isn't necessarily cheap, however they can be
cheap.
>
> Due to the pricing structure of cloud and VPS services they are both
> attractive to spammers, and the spammers care not if they cause the
> netblocks
> they use to be scorched. They simply then move on to another VPS
> provider in
> search of "clean" cloud/VPS netblocks to spam from.

We provide VPS packages if we don't trust the client they are forced to use
our relay (where we do spam filtering). That makes it almost unusable for
spammers (as we limit the number of emails per day and look to the numbers
they try to send and if needed block their email functionality completely).
>
> Clouds and VPS are fine for a few classes of applications. SMTP mail
> is not
> one of them.

As long as it is with a reputable provider there should be no problem to use
them for SMTP mail.

Mark
>
> --
> Stan

From: Steven King on 7 Aug 2010 15:35


On 8/7/10 9:09 AM, Jonathan Tripathy wrote:
>
> On 07/08/10 10:15, Stan Hoeppner wrote:
>> Julio Cesar Covolato put forth on 8/7/2010 12:37 AM:
>>
>>
>>> Is there anyone using postfix in cloud, like Amazon ec2?
>>>
>> Dunno about Postfix specifically, but there are/were many spammers
>> operating
>> out of the Amazon cloud as well as the Rackspace cloud. Even if they
>> are
>> clean now, their reputation is still low due to prior traffic.
>>
>>
>>> My questions:
>>> Is this interesting?
>>> The pros and cons..
>>> Other clound sistem...
>>> Why and why not to cloud postfix.
>>>
>>> Anyone?
>>>
>> No pros, only cons. TINW wholesale block SMTP from Amazon's cloud,
>> Rackspace's cloud, etc. Mail emitted from clouds and VPS servers at
>> cheap
>> ISPs has a much higher chance of being blocked, delayed, etc than
>> that from a
>> colo'd box at a reputable provider.
>>
>> Due to the pricing structure of cloud and VPS services they are both
>> attractive to spammers, and the spammers care not if they cause the
>> netblocks
>> they use to be scorched. They simply then move on to another VPS
>> provider in
>> search of "clean" cloud/VPS netblocks to spam from.
>>
>> Clouds and VPS are fine for a few classes of applications. SMTP mail
>> is not
>> one of them.
>>
>>
>
> There is nothing wrong with using Postfix on a VPS. Works great. Been
> using it for ages. Companies that block whole netblock of VPS ISP are
> being a bit silly, as VPS are becoming used more and more for
> businesses. Of course, VPS ISPs should always do checks to make sure
> that a person signing up is who they say they are - A simple credit
> card name and address would suffice I guess.
Technologically Postfix will run fine on VPS systems yes. Even if it is
silly for companies to block full CIDR ranges from sending email, it
does happen a lot. AOL, Comcast, Verizon, MSN, etc... all do it.

Also, having a valid credit card, name and address isn't any indication
that the person isn't going to spam. Knowing who a person is by name,
and financially isn't the same as knowing their intentions. Also, there
is a lot of fraud going on out there. I have seen people send copies of
their ID, and credit card and they not be who they are pretending to be.
This happens more than one might realize.

--
Steve King

Senior Linux Engineer - Advance Internet, Inc.
Cisco Certified Network Associate
CompTIA Linux+ Certified Professional
CompTIA A+ Certified Professional

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