What would be the fastest dial-up access speed if phone systems had 144 dB of dynamic range?
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From: Green Xenon on 16 Nov 2009 21:58 >Green Xenon wrote: >>>>> Green Xenon <green_xenon1(a)yahoo.com> wrote: >> >>>> Let's say the updated telephone systems have a dynamic range of 144 dB >> and >>>> a bandwidth of 20 kHz [as opposed to 4 kHz]. What would be the maximum >>>> speed possible of the dial-up internet access? >> >>> Who cares? Aint gonna happen. >> >> I'm just curious, since I like the nostalgia of dial-up > >Nothing stops you from using dial-up now. 56 Kb is part of the experience. > I'm still interested in ways dial-up could be made faster than cable while still having all its signals in the human audio spectrum. Hence, I daydream about the telephone systems updating themselves. Bandwidth should include frequencies from 20 Hz to 20 kHz, not above or below that spectrum. Dynamic range should be as large as physically-possible without the phones and modems requiring power supplies of their own*. *Cordless and many corded phones require 110v [220v outside of USA/Canada] power supplies of their own to function. I don't want this requirement for any of my phones, modems or other telephone devices.
From: Green Xenon on 17 Nov 2009 15:55 >Green Xenon wrote: >>> Not that you'd actually see 24 bits even if you increased the quality of >>> the D/A converter -- 24 bits of precision is well below the threshold of >> >>> seeing 2nd order effects, and into the really weird stuff. >> >> >> But isn't it possible to build phone systems than can handle 144 dB [24 >> bits] of dynamic range? > >Yes. It is also possible to build phone systems with a 20KHz bandwidth. >Who would pay for it? How much does it cost to boost the phone systems from a dynamic range of 48 dB all the way up to 144 dB?
From: glen herrmannsfeldt on 17 Nov 2009 17:04 Green Xenon <green_xenon1(a)yahoo.com> wrote: (snip) > How much does it cost to boost the phone systems from a > dynamic range of 48 dB all the way up to 144 dB? I will guess that it increases your phone bill by about a factor of 100. Amplifiers with 100dB S/N aren't so hard to find, but 144dB is much harder. Also, the only way this could be done is to run a digital signal all the way to the house and do the conversion there. I am pretty sure the existing phone wiring, including crosstalk, isn't anywhere close. -- glen
From: Green Xenon on 17 Nov 2009 17:49 >Green Xenon <green_xenon1(a)yahoo.com> wrote: >(snip) > >> How much does it cost to boost the phone systems from a >> dynamic range of 48 dB all the way up to 144 dB? > >I will guess that it increases your phone bill by about >a factor of 100. Amplifiers with 100dB S/N aren't so hard to >find, but 144dB is much harder. Also, the only way this could >be done is to run a digital signal all the way to the house and >do the conversion there. I am pretty sure the existing phone >wiring, including crosstalk, isn't anywhere close. > >-- glen > What is the maximum dynamic range that analog telephones system [used for dial-up internet access] can be built to provide? You said 144 dB to too much. Is 100 dB also too much. Also, could the analog telephone systems be simulated digitally so that one can experience the nostalgia of dial-up [dialing the phone numbers and hearing the modem tones] while using cable/DSL so that the speed is much faster. I ask because it is possible to perfectly emulate Gameboys and Nintendo games on today's fast PCs. I have a gameboy emulator that works perfectly. For NES games I visits virtualnes.com and playnes.net. These online NES emulators work perfectly. So I'm wondering if the nostalgia of dial-up can be emulators with an added advantages of the high-speed of the cable/DSL internet service being physically provided. A lot of old equipment are now being digitally-emulated without failure.
From: Green Xenon on 17 Nov 2009 21:02
>Green Xenon wrote: >. >> Also, could the analog telephone systems be simulated digitally so that >> one can experience the nostalgia of dial-up [dialing the phone numbers and >> hearing the modem tones] while using cable/DSL so that the speed is much >> faster. >> > > >Sample it. The modem dialup sound is probably in a sample or effects >library somewhere. You could use it as the ring tone on your mobile. You >could record the sound of a fax connection. Can't be that different, really. > >For myself, I feel no nostalgia, didn't think dialup was worth what one >had to pay for it, and definitely not the number of times the ISP went >down altogether. Punched ticker tape readers - now that was something to >get nostalgic about. A prof I know still has a stack of computer punched >cards on a shelf, in "as-new" condition. Doubt if he is nostalgic about >the week-long turnaround for the results though. > >Richard Dobson > > > 1. It's not just the sound that's nostalgic but pretty much everything perceptible about the dial-up internet access. So if it could be simulated on a modern cable internet connection [like NES and gameboys can be simulated on modern PCs]. That would be both nostalgic and fast. This simulated dial-up can be much faster because the devices involved in cable internet access have a much larger dynamic range than those involved in actual dial-up access. 2. To me, fax and dial-up modems sound *very* different from each other. 3. Dial-up can be free. Here: http://www.fastfreedialup.com/free_dialup_access_numbers.html#connect |