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From: SAM on 8 Jun 2010 06:29
Le 6/8/10 5:12 AM, Garrett Smith a �crit :
> On 6/7/2010 4:12 PM, SAM wrote:
>> Le 6/6/10 11:40 AM, Ry Nohryb a �crit :
>>> On Jun 6, 8:50 am, VK <schools_r...(a)yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>> On Jun 6, 7:50 am, Garrett Smith <dhtmlkitc...(a)gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> http://developer.apple.com/safaridemos/
>>>>> Click through to "View Demo" and you'll likely see the error message:
>>>>> | This demo was designed with the latest web standards supported by
>>>>> | Safari.
>>>> Your objection is not clear. The page is called "Safari Technology
>>>> Demos" and it does what has been declared: it demonstrates supported
>>>> HTML5 features in latest Safari versions. Obviously in order to
>>>> demonstrate these features in this browser, the page needs to be
>>>> viewed using Safari.
>>
>> Not exactly, since I could see some of their demos with my old Firefox.3
>
> I can see the audio demo now in Firefox. It doesn't work, but I can at
> least load the page.

From /safaridemos/ you can go to the presentation of each demo.
Then there you have a button to see the demo :
the right-click --> open in new window/tab
works in my Firefox.3


360� (OK Fx.3) (2Mo !! whom 72 images)
<http://developer.apple.com/safaridemos/showcase/threesixty/>
typo (+/- OK Fx.3) (Fx.3.6 ?)
<http://developer.apple.com/safaridemos/showcase/typography/>
video (movy: 39 Mo) (mask effect)
<http://developer.apple.com/safaridemos/showcase/video/>
transitions bettwen images - where is the html.5 here I don't know
(didn't work in my Safari before images all in cache)
<http://developer.apple.com/safaridemos/showcase/transitions/>
web gallery (!work Fx.3 CSS webkit ?)
<http://developer.apple.com/safaridemos/showcase/gallery/>


[...]
>>> Exactly. But Garrett has problems with reading comprehension.
[...]
> Making inferences of userAgent is missing the point of HTML 5.

But as here it is a demo for webkit ...
(surely with webkit CSS (3?) )
.... why not to not allow other browsers than those webkit build ?

[...]
>> example :
>> <http://developer.apple.com/safaridemos/showcase/audio/>
>> Hu ?! with Fx, this day I see here a link covering the demo,
>> With Safari.4 my QuickTime (7.6) seems OK
>
> Quicktime? Where is that defined in HTML5?

I speak of QT about <audio> in Safari because the HTML.5 default audio
console looks like this of QT.
Certainly (I hope, but who know, as I am on Mac) QT's plug-in is not
used here.

[...]
> Quicktime has never worked well.

On Mac ... not too bad, not too bad ...
.... depends additional plug-ins you offered to your QT ?

> As a plugin, it actually has worse usability the flash player.

For sure.

>> And more, the Safari's error console :
>> TypeError: Result of expression
>> 'document.getElementById('matrixSelect')' [null] is not an object.
(...)
> Only one browser and it still doesn't work? That is really sad.

The console shows errors I'm not sure they are important
(Fx's console can too show a lot of errors that don't stop to work)

> Apparently they do not check the error console for the *one* browser
> they support and do not do any QA.

;-)

> I see that their web development team is still experiencing the sorts of
> very basic mistakes.

You can find in Apple's pages (section dev) a lot of given JS codes not
conform and +/- old (but working out of the "standards")

> As far as the choice to use Prototype.js -- they probably learned
> Prototype.js out of a need for solutions to help them to do their job
> and, being incapable of solving such problems on their own,

.... Prototype.js ... the wound of web ...

--
sm
From: Richard Cornford on 8 Jun 2010 06:55
On Jun 7, 12:42 pm, RobG wrote:
> On Jun 6, 1:50 pm, Garrett Smith wrote:
>
>> http://developer.apple.com/safaridemos/
>
>> Click through to "View Demo" and you'll likely see the error
>> message:
>
>> | This demo was designed with the latest web standards supported
>> | by Safari.
<snip>
> ... , it makes them look like complete idiots. Change
> the UA string in Safari to Firefox 3.5.3 and you get the same
> message.
<snip>

There is no need to change the UA string in Safari. I haven't (and
don't actually know how to, never having been bothered to look into
it) and yet:-

<URL: http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/cornford/sillyApple.gif >

- the same message shows in Safari. Obviously what they should have
said in that context was that a more up-to-date version of Safari was
necessary, but that is not the message that was presented to me.
Clearly the thinking in relation to these demos hasn't considered all
(or apparently many of) the possibilities, suggesting minimal web
authoring experience on the part of its creators, which in tern
explains the pedestrian code authoring in the demos.

Richard.
From: David Mark on 8 Jun 2010 10:56
On Jun 6, 5:36 am, Ry Nohryb <jo...(a)jorgechamorro.com> wrote:
> On Jun 6, 8:55 am, Garrett Smith <dhtmlkitc...(a)gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > On 6/5/2010 11:35 PM, Joe Nine wrote:
>
> > > This doesn't surprise me from Apple. They probably want viewers to think
> > > this stuff only works on Safari.
>
> Because most of this stuff currently only works in Safari: YES, Safari
> is the leader, whether you like it or not.

In terms of what exactly? Proprietary rounded corners?

>
> > Right. They hype up how cool it is and then, oh, sorry, if you want to
> > see it, go download Safari. They want to make something cool that works
> > only in Safari. They then fib to the public that these cool things are
> > standards and Apple is just way ahead of other browsers in supporting them.
>
> > It is an attempt at a massive public deception.
>
> As usual, you're able to read but not to comprehend.
>
> > | The demos below show how the latest version of Apple’s Safari web
> > | browser, new Macs, and new Apple mobile devices all support the
> > | capabilities of HTML5, CSS3, and JavaScript. Not all browsers offer
> > | this support. But soon other modern browsers will take advantage of
> > | these same web standards — and the amazing things they enable web
> > | designers to do.
>
> > Reading that, it comes off like Apple is ahead of the game.
>
> Because they *are* ahead.

What game? What's the score?

>
> > There is absolutely no reason for the browser sniffing; no reason for
> > not including equivalents to the proprietary css features such as
> > -webkit-border-radius.
>
> Browser makers are obligated to prepend their brand name in front of
> any proprietary CSS extensions. When/if their proprietary extensions
> ever make it into a w3 standard, then the prefix will be removed. E.g.
> Mozillas have their own moz-border too.

I presume you meant something else (-moz-border-radius?)

> Now that it's a w3 standard
> (not yet, but almost there),

:) Why not stop there?

> you can type just border-radius, but only
> a few browsers (and not all safaris) will recognize it in the
> standards-compliant prefix-less way.

I figured you wouldn't. :( BTW, IE9's preview handles border-
radius. So what?

>
> And, for many of Apple's proposed-as-a-standard extensions there are
> no equivalences yet: CSS 2d transitions, CSS 2d animations, CSS 3d
> transitions, CSS 3d animations, etc.

Opera has had CSS transitions for a while. Chrome even longer.


>
> Also, no other browser but Safari is currently able to play h264
> <video> nor AAV <audio>, nor 3d webGL content, nor... etc.

So what? No other browser but IE can play audio with a BGSOUND
element.

>
> > Proprietary features that aren't part of HTML 5 or CSS3 can be expected
> > to fail in other browsers, however such things cannot be honestly called
> > HTML 5 and CSS3.
>
> Yes they can, because they're on the w3 table for standardization in/
> as HTML5.

On the table?
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