From: Hal Rosser on

"Mark Rae [MVP]" <mark(a)markNOSPAMrae.net> wrote in message
news:uwMloC%23PIHA.4684(a)TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl...
> "Hal Rosser" <hmrosser(a)bellsouth.net> wrote in message
> news:mP29j.21451$vt2.5034(a)bignews8.bellsouth.net...
>
>> I believe the W3C is deprecating frames, framesets, and Iframes in favor
>> of using div tags and css.
>
> How did you arrive at that conclusion...?
> http://www.w3.org/TR/html401/present/frames.html
> http://www.w3.org/TR/html401/sgml/framesetdtd.html
> http://www.w3.org/TR/xhtml1/dtds.html#a_dtd_XHTML-1.0-Frameset
> http://www.w3.org/TR/xhtml-modularization/abstract_modules.html#s_framesmodule
>
>
>> xhtml is (slowly) replacing html.
>
> Depends who you talk to:
> http://www.webdevout.net/articles/beware-of-xhtml
>
>
> --
> Mark Rae
> ASP.NET MVP
> http://www.markrae.net
You may be right.
Can you use frames in a valid html strict DTD ?
I just go by what I read and hear.
If you say it ain't so - and you have that MVP title- then I must believe
you.
Why are there rumors that frames are being deprecated?

here's a link you might like
http://htmlhelp.com/reference/html40/html/doctype.html#strict
and here's one from the w3c http://www.w3.org/TR/html401/index/elements.html
have fun



From: Mark Rae [MVP] on
"Hal Rosser" <hmrosser(a)bellsouth.net> wrote in message
news:U9o9j.41239$L%6.27717(a)bignews3.bellsouth.net...

> Can you use frames in a valid html strict DTD ?

HTML 4.01 has three DTDs:

HTML 4.01 Strict DTD includes all elements and attributes that have not been
deprecated or do not appear in frameset documents.

HTML 4.01 Transitional DTD includes everything in the strict DTD plus
deprecated elements and attributes.

HTML 4.01 Frameset DTD includes everything in the transitional DTD plus
elements and attributes for creating frames. If frames are avoided, there is
no need to use this DTD.


> Why are there rumors that frames are being deprecated?

I have no idea...


> here's a link you might like
> http://htmlhelp.com/reference/html40/html/doctype.html#strict
> and here's one from the w3c
> http://www.w3.org/TR/html401/index/elements.html

What am I supposed to learn from those...?


--
Mark Rae
ASP.NET MVP
http://www.markrae.net

From: Hal Rosser on

"Mark Rae [MVP]" <mark(a)markNOSPAMrae.net> wrote in message
news:uF3u5GIQIHA.5400(a)TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...
> "Hal Rosser" <hmrosser(a)bellsouth.net> wrote in message
> news:U9o9j.41239$L%6.27717(a)bignews3.bellsouth.net...
>
>> Can you use frames in a valid html strict DTD ?
>
> HTML 4.01 has three DTDs:
>
> HTML 4.01 Strict DTD includes all elements and attributes that have not
> been deprecated or do not appear in frameset documents.
>
> HTML 4.01 Transitional DTD includes everything in the strict DTD plus
> deprecated elements and attributes.
>
> HTML 4.01 Frameset DTD includes everything in the transitional DTD plus
> elements and attributes for creating frames. If frames are avoided, there
> is no need to use this DTD.
>
>
>> Why are there rumors that frames are being deprecated?
>
> I have no idea...
>
>
>> here's a link you might like
>> http://htmlhelp.com/reference/html40/html/doctype.html#strict
>> and here's one from the w3c
>> http://www.w3.org/TR/html401/index/elements.html
>
> What am I supposed to learn from those...?
** That Strict DTD is the only DTD that does not allow deprecated tags.
** Strict DTD does not allow frames.
therefore : yes, lets hear it - frames will be going away as the industry
moves to strict DTD.

>
>
> --
> Mark Rae
> ASP.NET MVP
> http://www.markrae.net

The transitional DTD and the frameset DTD allow deprecated tags, but the
strict DTD does not, right?
The Strict DTD does not allow framesets, right?
Deprecated tags should not be used because the support for those tags will
eventually go away, right?
Shouldn't one expect that when the deprecated tags go away, so will the DTDs
that allow them?
Since the frameset DTD is one of those DTDs that allow deprecated tags, then
it will probably go away.
The end



From: Mark Rae [MVP] on
"Hal Rosser" <hmrosser(a)bellsouth.net> wrote in message
news:h8F9j.44813$K27.40297(a)bignews6.bellsouth.net...

> The transitional DTD and the frameset DTD allow deprecated tags, but the
> strict DTD does not, right?

The frameset DTD is an extension of the transitional DTD which includes
frames.

> The Strict DTD does not allow framesets, right?

Right - that's what the frameset DTD is for...

> Deprecated tags should not be used because the support for those tags will
> eventually go away, right?

There are eleven tags which are deprecated in the strict DTD: APPLET,
BASEFONT, CENTER, DIR, FONT, IFRAME, ISINDEX, MENU, S, STRIKE, and U. They
will eventually be removed from the frameset DTD too. However, the frameset
DTD itself will remain for the forseeable future, specifically to support
frames - that's what it's for...

> Shouldn't one expect that when the deprecated tags go away, so will the
> DTDs that allow them?

The transitional DTD will eventually disappear leaving only strict DTD and
frameset DTD.

> Since the frameset DTD is one of those DTDs that allow deprecated tags,
> then it will probably go away.

It will remain as long as the strict DTD - both will eventually be replaced
by newer standards...


--
Mark Rae
ASP.NET MVP
http://www.markrae.net