Backup program for OpenSuse 11.3
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From: Aragorn on 27 Jul 2010 15:48 On Tuesday 27 July 2010 21:08 in alt.os.linux, somebody identifying as J G Miller wrote... > On Tuesday, July 27th, 2010 at 12:42:14h -0500, Mjt wrote: > >> JBJ's the one, IIRC, who came out here originally looking for a >> GNU/Linux distro that looks and acts like Windows. > > Yes that is correct. > > I am rather surprised that he did not go with PC Linux OS > > <http://pclinuxos.COM/> Ehm... I happen to be running PCLinuxOS (2009.2) on this machine here, but I don't see how this would even remotely look anything like Windows. -- *Aragorn* (registered GNU/Linux user #223157)
From: J G Miller on 27 Jul 2010 16:28 On Tuesday, July 27th, 2010 at 21:48:03 +0200, Aragorn wrote: > > Ehm... I happen to be running PCLinuxOS (2009.2) on this machine here, > but I don't see how this would even remotely look anything like Windows. I did not mean to imply that PC Linux OS looks like Windoze, but wrote what I did, because PC Linux OS has always been marketed as the distribution supposedly easiest for Windoze refugess to use. Before PC Linux OS migrated to KDE 4, was it not more Windoze like in its desktop layout?
From: Aragorn on 27 Jul 2010 19:11 On Tuesday 27 July 2010 22:28 in alt.os.linux, somebody identifying as J G Miller wrote... > On Tuesday, July 27th, 2010 at 21:48:03 +0200, Aragorn wrote: >> >> Ehm... I happen to be running PCLinuxOS (2009.2) on this machine >> here, but I don't see how this would even remotely look anything like >> Windows. > > I did not mean to imply that PC Linux OS looks like Windoze, but wrote > what I did, because PC Linux OS has always been marketed as the > distribution supposedly easiest for Windoze refugess to use. Hmm... I have personally never had heard of PCLinuxOS being mentioned as such. I chose it for this machine here because I needed something that was easily deployable, with a sufficiently large repository and that was fast to customize, and PCLinuxOS is based upon Mandriva, which I am familiar with - or actually, with Mandriva's predecessor, Mandrake. I do however tend to customize a lot about the system - both in terms of the operating system itself and in terms of my desktop environment - as one of the first things I do after installation. > Before PC Linux OS migrated to KDE 4, was it not more Windoze like > in its desktop layout? Now that I'm thinking about it, it may have had some Windows-like things about it when I first installed it - and quite a lot more than Mandriva, upon which it is based - but as explained briefly above, one of the first things I do is customize everything - maybe that's why I didn't pay much attention to what it looked like "out of the box". I have my very own specific "KDE styling" that I apply, and as such, it doesn't look anything like Windows anymore now, if it ever did. Unless of course you would consider having a panel at the bottom Windows-like, but I also have a thinner panel at the top of the screen, which houses the menus of KDE-specific applications, similar to how it has always been on a MacIntosh. Both panels have a "K menu" icon, and on the top panel I have a few icons for direct access to files in the form of a menu - it displays directory entries as menu items, but I don't know what it's called - along with (on the right hand) a system monitor applet that shows the uptime and the CPU load, a bookmarks icon, a file finder icon, a screenshot icon and the KDE configuration panel icon. The bottom panel houses (from left to right) the "K menu", a terminal emulator menu, a "log out" and "lock screen" button pair, a "show desktop" icon, the virtual desktop pager, the taskbar, a bunch of icons for often-used applications (calculator, editor, Konqueror (both as file manager and as browser), Firefox), the system tray, the clock and then to the far right the package manager and the Mandriva Control Center, which PCLinuxOS has inherited. I also use the "System ++" window decorations, which have the "window close" button on the left hand of the titlebar, along with the "Keramik" widget style, a color scheme of my own, and my own fonts and font sizes, and my own preferences for keyboard shorcuts - e.g. I always replace Alt+F4 by Alt+Esc for closing a window, among other things. I also reorganize which icons go on the panel and which don't, and I delete a lot of superfluous icons from the desktop, of which I must admit that PCLinuxOS did come with a lot of those. It is not my intent to make the GUI look like a MacIntosh - I have sat at a pre-OS X Mac a few times, but I don't exactly consider that to be the perfect GUI for me either - but it just so happens to be that some of the things I have implemented are MacIntosh-like, while other things may come from e.g. OS/2 - I have in the past used OS/2 for over five years, and conversely I have only used Windows (NT) for two years, and a few months on DOS 5.0 with Windows 3.0 when I had just bought my first computer in 1991 and while I was awaiting the release of the first 32-bit version of OS/2. (Before that I had always been using DOS (3.30 and 4.01) on x86 machines (which were not my own), and I had some minor non-root experience on UNIX as well.) I have no experience with KDE 4.x yet - although soon I will - but one of the things I've always liked about KDE is its customizability, not just in theming but also in organization. You can literally make it look like whatever you want, and I make ample use of that. ;-) One of the things I appreciate very much now in this KDE 3.5.10 and which I did not have yet in earlier KDE versions is Yakuake. If you're not familiar with KDE, it's a pull-down terminal emulator, akin to Konsole. You bring it up with a shortcut key - typically F12 - and it's incredibly handy. It also supports tabs, so you can have multiple terminal emulators open in it at the same time, just as with Konsole. It also supports the same pseudo-transparency. I use it a lot; it doesn't need an entry in the taskbar and I don't have to switch to a different virtual desktop (or to a virtual console) in order to use a terminal or wait for Konsole to open. It's there when you need it, and it's out of your way when you don't. ;-) -- *Aragorn* (registered GNU/Linux user #223157)
From: J G Miller on 27 Jul 2010 19:56 On Wednesday, July 28th, 2010 at 01:11:34h +0200, Aragorn wrote: > > Hmm... I have personally never had heard of PCLinuxOS being mentioned > as such. Maybe you have not read enough reviews in the past. In no way do I wish to disparage PCLinuxOS and think that it provides a great distribution with an approach different to other distributions, but it really did, when it first started, bill its-self as the system for people who were used to Windows. And even more recently one can find From <http://pclosmag.COM/html/Issues/200906/page03.html> QUOTE The KDE in PCLinuxOS looked and felt like Windows Explorer, with its 'Start' Button, and the Quick Launch-like panel beside it. Even the window I opened when I accessed my Lacie Drive was reminiscent of Explorer, and this made it SO EASY for me to adapt to and use. THIS is how Linux SHOULD BE. UNQUOTE From <http://www.linuxtoday.COM/news_story.php3?ltsn=2007-10-05-001-26-RV-MD-SW> QUOTE Could PCLinuxOS 2007 Spell Death for Windows on the Desktop? PCLinuxOS 2007 sports a snappy KDE interface that falls somewhere between the look and feel of Windows XP and the fresh coolness of Vista without all the heaviness that accompanies Vista. UNQUOTE From <http://www.dedoimedo.COM/computers/pclinuxos-2010.html> QUOTE PCLinuxOS is a distribution that aims to lure unsuspecting Windows users into the warm fold of Linux. To this end, the KDE theme is somewhat tweaked to make them more comfortable and at home. You get a classic K-Menu and the taskbar is very Windows-like, with stacked and spaced icons for open applications. UNQUOTE Do you see a pattern in these reviews? > PCLinuxOS is based upon Mandriva, which I am familiar with - or actually, > with Mandriva's predecessor, Mandrake. Which prompts the question for the curious, why did you not want to stay with Mandriva? > I have my very own specific "KDE styling" From what you have stated further down, you are still using KDE 3.5. You are going to get a shock then when you discover that you will not be able to take very much of your customizations to KDE 4. > The bottom panel houses (from left to right) the "K menu" I always liked the tiles that one could apply to the panel buttons, sadly in KDE 4 that is all gone. > I have no experience with KDE 4.x yet To say that it is a little different in appearance and form is an understatement.
From: Aragorn on 27 Jul 2010 20:32
On Wednesday 28 July 2010 01:56 in alt.os.linux, somebody identifying as J G Miller wrote... > On Wednesday, July 28th, 2010 at 01:11:34h +0200, Aragorn wrote: >> >> Hmm... I have personally never had heard of PCLinuxOS being >> mentioned as such. > > Maybe you have not read enough reviews in the past. *That* is quite possible. :-) > In no way do I wish to disparage PCLinuxOS and think that it provides > a great distribution with an approach different to other > distributions, but it really did, when it first started, bill its-self > as the system for people who were used to Windows. > > And even more recently one can find > > From <http://pclosmag.COM/html/Issues/200906/page03.html> > > QUOTE > > The KDE in PCLinuxOS looked and felt like Windows Explorer, with its > 'Start' Button, and the Quick Launch-like panel beside it. There was no "Start" button in this one, because that's something I would have remembered. It was just the typical "K menu", with an icon that reads "PC". I'm not sure on what he means by that "quick launch" thing, but if he means the new, wider "K menu" as it first appeared in SuSE, then that is available, but not enabled by default. The default was the classic KDE menu, and that's also what I'm using. > Even the window I opened when I accessed my Lacie Drive was > reminiscent of Explorer, and this made it SO EASY for me to adapt to > and use. > > THIS is how Linux SHOULD BE. Written by a Win-addict, obviously. ;-) > UNQUOTE > > From > <http://www.linuxtoday.COM/news_story.php3?ltsn=2007-10-05-001-26-RV-MD-SW> > > QUOTE > > Could PCLinuxOS 2007 Spell Death for Windows on the Desktop? > > PCLinuxOS 2007 sports a snappy KDE interface that falls somewhere > between the look and feel of Windows XP and the fresh coolness of > Vista without all the heaviness that accompanies Vista. > > UNQUOTE Well, this is the 2009.2 release, and I don't know what earlier versions looked like. It's the first time I'm using PCLinuxOS. > From <http://www.dedoimedo.COM/computers/pclinuxos-2010.html> > > QUOTE > > PCLinuxOS is a distribution that aims to lure unsuspecting Windows > users into the warm fold of Linux. > > To this end, the KDE theme is somewhat tweaked to make them more > comfortable and at home. > > You get a classic K-Menu and the taskbar is very Windows-like, with > stacked and spaced icons for open applications. > > UNQUOTE Again written by someone who has never seen anything other than Windows, obviously. The KDE taskbar has always had stacked and spaced buttons for open applications, even back in KDE 1.x. > Do you see a pattern in these reviews? Yes, they're all written by Win-droolers. ;-) >> PCLinuxOS is based upon Mandriva, which I am familiar with - or >> actually, with Mandriva's predecessor, Mandrake. > > Which prompts the question for the curious, why did you not want to > stay with Mandriva? I'm not sure but I think that it had to do with Mandriva having switched to KDE 4.x, which was still quite buggy at the time and lacked lots of functionality, or so I gathered from my residence in the Mandriva group. I knew that PCLinuxOS still offered KDE 3.5.10. Another reason is somewhat political. Even though Mandriva is a good all-round distribution, Mandriva as a company has made some bad goof-ups over the years, which exhibit a severe dose of corporatitis. They've actually even kicked out their own founder "due to cutbacks". This is something that a lot of us Mandrake/Mandriva users have taken the wrong way, myself included. Another point of criticism is that Mandriva has for quite a few years already been adding more Windows'isms, and they are of course not the only distro to go there, but that doesn't mean that I like it. And as stated, I was unfamiliar with PCLinuxOS, apart from that it still came with KDE 3.5.10 and that it was based on Mandriva. I didn't even know that it came as a downloadable live CD only until I actually looked for it on the mirrors in order to download it. Mind you, PCLinuxOS is far from perfect as well. There were some terrible things going wrong with the package manager when I had first installed it. Installing certain additional packages like "ispell" for instance would result in "ldconfig" being deleted from the system, rendering it unbootable. This was scheduled to happen when installing many other packages as well. I reported this gross screw-up to the package maintainers, but I haven't seen any follow-ups to it, and I have since then abstained from installing too many additional packages. >> I have my very own specific "KDE styling" > > From what you have stated further down, you are still using KDE 3.5. Yes, KDE 3.5.10. That was one of the reasons why I opted for PCLinuxOS. > You are going to get a shock then when you discover that you will > not be able to take very much of your customizations to KDE 4. Well, those customizations are not restored from files, though. I start from scratch, but I just always change the same things, and into the same (or a similarly enough) styling. >> The bottom panel houses (from left to right) the "K menu" > > I always liked the tiles that one could apply to the panel buttons, > sadly in KDE 4 that is all gone. I didn't like those, actually. ;-) >> I have no experience with KDE 4.x yet > > To say that it is a little different in appearance and form > is an understatement. I know... I've seen the screenshots and a few YouTube videos of it. I am however hoping that it'll still allow me to customize it to my liking. :-/ -- *Aragorn* (registered GNU/Linux user #223157) |