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From: Jerry Avins on 22 Apr 2010 17:54 On 4/22/2010 3:41 PM, Eric Jacobsen wrote: ... >> Hippy bidet! >> > > BTW, that's just my subtle, twisted way of wishing you a Happy Birthday. ;) It reminds me of an animal cartoon: hippo, birdie, two ewes. Jerry -- "It does me no injury for my neighbor to say there are 20 gods, or no God. It neither picks my pocket nor breaks my leg." Thomas Jefferson to the Virginia House of Delegates in 1776. ���������������������������������������������������������������������
From: Jerry Avins on 22 Apr 2010 18:04 On 4/22/2010 6:34 AM, Heinrich Wolf wrote: ... > PS: Ah, now it occured to me why probably Jerry thought that Budweis > is in the north of Bohemia: ... I reversed what you wrote: "In 1938, when the Sudetenland, the mostly German speaking part of Czechoslovakia, came to Germany, Pilsen stayed in the Czech state, a few kilometers from the new border, while Budweis came to Germany." Jerry -- "It does me no injury for my neighbor to say there are 20 gods, or no God. It neither picks my pocket nor breaks my leg." Thomas Jefferson to the Virginia House of Delegates in 1776. ���������������������������������������������������������������������
From: Eric Jacobsen on 23 Apr 2010 17:07 On 4/23/2010 9:41 AM, brent wrote: > On Apr 23, 12:12 pm, Eric Jacobsen<eric.jacob...(a)ieee.org> wrote: >> On 4/23/2010 9:02 AM, Clay wrote: >> >> >> >> >> I will warn beer drinkers that this site can be a huge time sink, but >> Sam Adams has a really excellent "beer encyclopedia" on their website.... > > > It might take time away from World of Warcraft? Battlefield. -- Eric Jacobsen Minister of Algorithms Abineau Communications http://www.abineau.com
From: Clay on 23 Apr 2010 11:12 On Apr 22, 10:41 am, Heinrich Wolf <mu...(a)hemedarwa.de> wrote: > Heinrich Wolf <mu...(a)hemedarwa.de> writes: > > Rick Lyons <R.Lyons@_BOGUS_ieee.org> writes: > > >> Brent, your posts have tickled me. I now declare that I officially > >> owe you a bottle of the finest Czechoslovakian pilsner beer. > > >> Pilsner beer did NOT originate in Germany. Pilsner beer, > >> as far as I've read, originated in Pilzen Czechoslovakia. > > > Rick, you have taught lots of people DSP and I grew up only about > > 100km from Pilsen: so allow me some notes on European history. > > ... > > I just looked into German Wikipediahttp://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pilsner_Bier > where they say > > Da das ehemalige Pilsner Bier " ein dunkles, trübes, warm vergorenes > Bier " einen so schlechten Ruf hatte, dass sogar mehrere Fässer Bier > aus Protest öffentlich auf dem Rathausplatz ausgeschüttet wurden, > berief der Pilsner Braumeister Martin Stelzer des "Bürgerlichen > Brauhauses" in Pilsen 1842 den bayerischen Braumeister Josef Groll > aus Vilshofen nach Pilsen, um "den Böhmen in Pilsen ein gutes Bier > zu brauen". Josef Groll braute somit am 5. Oktober 1842 den ersten > Sud nach Pilsner Brauart. Dieser wurde erstmals am 11. November 1842 > öffentlich ausgeschenkt und eröffnete so den weltweiten Siegeszug > dieser Bierspezialität, die als Original Pilsner Urquell vertrieben > wird. > > Short translation: The original beer in Pilsen was a bad, > top-fermented beer, so bad that at some occasion several barrels > were poored away for protest. Therefor the brewer Martin Stelzer (a > German name) called in 1842 Josef Groll from Vilshofen on the > Danube, Bavaria, to produce a good, bottom-fermented beer. This was > the origin of the ``Pilsner Bier''. > > A note as we are in a technical group: two types of fermentation > processes are in use top-fermentation and bottom-fermentation where > the first requires a temperature of 12 or 15 Celsius and the second 6 > or 8 Celsius. > > Having a cellar at 15 Celsius is no problem in southern Germany while > having 8 Celsius also late in the summer is hard w/o some cooling. > Before mechanical cooling machines were available, ice from ponds was > collected and icicles where grown on special wooden constructions in > the winter. The ice was filled into a huge cellar where the cellar > used for fermentation was below or near a lower edge. Then, when > temperature in the fermentation cellar got too high, a door was opened > such that cold air from the ice-cellar sank in. After a warm winter > and a hot summer not enough ice may have been left and beer got bad. > > So one may claim that Bavarian beer would not exist w/o the rather > cold winters there. > > -- > hw I recall seeing in a tv program about the origin of Lagers being when it got too hot and the beer would spoil, that the brewers would heat up rocks in fires until they glowed red and then placed the hot rocks into the beer kegs so as to boil and sterilize the beer so it wouldn't spoil. Clay maybe some of you beer afficianados could add the the details.
From: Gordon Sande on 23 Apr 2010 11:49
On 2010-04-23 12:12:32 -0300, Clay <clay(a)claysturner.com> said: > On Apr 22, 10:41�am, Heinrich Wolf <mu...(a)hemedarwa.de> wrote: >> Heinrich Wolf <mu...(a)hemedarwa.de> writes: >>> Rick Lyons <R.Lyons@_BOGUS_ieee.org> writes: >> >>>> Brent, your posts have tickled me. �I now declare that I officially >>>> owe you a bottle of the finest Czechoslovakian pilsner beer. >> >>>> Pilsner beer did NOT originate in Germany. �Pilsner beer, >>>> as far as I've read, originated in Pilzen Czechoslovakia. >> >>> Rick, you have taught lots of people DSP and I grew up only about >>> 100km from Pilsen: so allow me some notes on European history. >>> ... >> >> I just looked into German Wikipediahttp://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pilsner_B > ier >> where they say >> >> � Da das ehemalige Pilsner Bier " ein dunkles, tr�bes, warm vergorene > s >> � Bier " einen so schlechten Ruf hatte, dass sogar mehrere F�sser Bie > r >> � aus Protest �ffentlich auf dem Rathausplatz ausgesch�ttet wurden, >> � berief der Pilsner Braumeister Martin Stelzer des "B�rgerlichen >> � Brauhauses" in Pilsen 1842 den bayerischen Braumeister Josef Groll >> � aus Vilshofen nach Pilsen, um "den B�hmen in Pilsen ein gutes Bier >> � zu brauen". Josef Groll braute somit am 5. Oktober 1842 den ersten >> � Sud nach Pilsner Brauart. Dieser wurde erstmals am 11. November 1842 >> � �ffentlich ausgeschenkt und er�ffnete so den weltweiten Siegeszug >> � dieser Bierspezialit�t, die als Original Pilsner Urquell vertrieben >> � wird. >> >> � Short translation: The original beer in Pilsen was a bad, >> � top-fermented beer, so bad that at some occasion several barrels >> � were poored away for protest. �Therefor the brewer Martin Stelzer ( > a >> � German name) called in 1842 Josef Groll from Vilshofen on the >> � Danube, Bavaria, to produce a good, bottom-fermented beer. �This wa > s >> � the origin of the ``Pilsner Bier''. >> >> A note as we are in a technical group: two types of fermentation >> processes are in use top-fermentation and bottom-fermentation where >> the first requires a temperature of 12 or 15 Celsius and the second 6 >> or 8 Celsius. >> >> Having a cellar at 15 Celsius is no problem in southern Germany while >> having 8 Celsius also late in the summer is hard w/o some cooling. >> Before mechanical cooling machines were available, ice from ponds was >> collected and icicles where grown on special wooden constructions in >> the winter. �The ice was filled into a huge cellar where the cellar >> used for fermentation was below or near a lower edge. �Then, when >> temperature in the fermentation cellar got too high, a door was opened >> such that cold air from the ice-cellar sank in. �After a warm winter >> and a hot summer not enough ice may have been left and beer got bad. >> >> So one may claim that Bavarian beer would not exist w/o the rather >> cold winters there. >> >> -- >> hw > > I recall seeing in a tv program about the origin of Lagers being when > it got too hot and the beer would spoil, that the brewers would heat > up rocks in fires until they glowed red and then placed the hot rocks > into the beer kegs so as to boil and sterilize the beer so it wouldn't > spoil. If it boiled wouldn't the alcohol come off first? Sort of defeats the purpose! I expect modern pasteurized beer involves some careful control of the pressures and containment during the heat treatment. > Clay > > maybe some of you beer afficianados could add the the details. |