From: DevilsPGD on
In message <hruvni$has$1(a)news.eternal-september.org> Bob Willard
<BobwBSGS(a)TrashThis.comcast.net> was claimed to have wrote:

>DevilsPGD wrote:
>> In message <hrua27$d64$1(a)news.eternal-september.org> Bob Willard
>> <BobwBSGS(a)TrashThis.comcast.net> was claimed to have wrote:
>>
>>> Maybe. I did have some luck cleaning the lens on one CDROM, using
>>> isopropanol applied with Qtips. But given that optical stuff gets
>>> better every year (like HDs), by the time your optical widget dies
>>> you will probably want this year's version instead.
>>
>> To a point, this was true. However modern optical drives don't seem to
>> be substantially better than 2 year old drives at this point.
>>
>> I think it's largely due to some physics limits in terms of how fast you
>> can spin cheap disks and how much vibration can be absorbed.
>
>Well, the next generation (meaning the stuff that I can't yet afford)
>is Blu-ray, and then comes multi-layer Blu-ray, and there will likely
>be shorter wavelength LASERs beyond that to crank up the areal density
>some more. I doubt if we have reached the absolute physical limits.

From what I understand, we're already about at the physical limits in
terms of rotational speeds existing disks can handle. Sure, many can
spin faster, but IIRC there were some fears of certain older disks
cracking and whatnot. That being said, it's easy enough to make design
tweaks going forward, adding a media speed indicator so that drives
would know what speed a disc is rated to handle.

Obviously high density can be accomplished, and ultimately our optical
media is still two-dimensional, moving to three dimensional formats will
open up a lot of higher density options (which also offers far higher
throughput if the same rotational speeds can be achieved -- If nothing
else, this moves the bottleneck to an area that is more easily
addressed)

However, my point was more that my 2-3 year old drives are still on par
with modern CDR/DVDR drives, there's no advancements that make them
worth replacing other than Bluray (which I don't really look at as an
"advancement" on current drives, as much as a new format entirely)

While I expect I'll have optical drives for the foreseeable future, in
my world optical drives are heading the way of the floppy. Oh, and yes
I still have a 3.5" floppy drive too. My optical drives get nearly as
much use as the floppy, which is to say none.

Between higher broadband penetration, flash media becoming so cheap, and
cloud computing slowly making inroads, I don't think we'll see much
beyond Bluray.
From: Arno on
DevilsPGD <Still-Just-A-Rat-In-A-Cage(a)crazyhat.net> wrote:
> In message <hrua27$d64$1(a)news.eternal-september.org> Bob Willard
> <BobwBSGS(a)TrashThis.comcast.net> was claimed to have wrote:

>>Maybe. I did have some luck cleaning the lens on one CDROM, using
>>isopropanol applied with Qtips. But given that optical stuff gets
>>better every year (like HDs), by the time your optical widget dies
>>you will probably want this year's version instead.

> To a point, this was true. However modern optical drives don't seem to
> be substantially better than 2 year old drives at this point.

I agree. There was a test in the lat issue of c't (they do
very thourough burn quality measurements with specialized
disk analysis equipment), and it seems burn quality has been
static the last few years and is not very good in general.

> I think it's largely due to some physics limits in terms of
> how fast you can spin cheap disks and how much vibration can
> be absorbed.

Also the burner firmware needs to know a specific disk model
to set the right parameters. This requires expensive tests
and frequent updates. Seems most vendors are not willing to
invest the effort.

The only reasonable burner c't identified was a Plextor
PX-8805A, with only bad (not very bad) CD writing quality,
average DVD writing quality and very good CD and DVD reading.
All others (Samsung, LG, Asus, Lite-On) were even worse.
INterestingly this seems to really be a formware issue, as
two other burners had the same hardware as the Plextor
(not made by Plextor, incidentially), but apparently
significantly worse firmware.

Arno
--
Arno Wagner, Dr. sc. techn., Dipl. Inform., CISSP -- Email: arno(a)wagner.name
GnuPG: ID: 1E25338F FP: 0C30 5782 9D93 F785 E79C 0296 797F 6B50 1E25 338F
----
Cuddly UI's are the manifestation of wishful thinking. -- Dylan Evans
From: Rod Speed on
Frank Williams wrote
> Rod Speed <rod.speed.aaa(a)gmail.com> wrote
>> me wrote
>>> Bob Willard <BobwBSGS(a)TrashThis.comcast.net> wrote
>>>> me wrote

>>>>> Looking for recommendations for a brand of DVD/CD reader/writer.
>>>>> Seems like all those I've purchased, regardless of name brand, die
>>>>> in a coupe years. Are there any that last longer? I see some LG &
>>>>> Samsung for low prices, are they junk or just as good as the rest
>>>>> of the crowd?

>>>>> FWIW, this is for an IDE interface.

>>>> All CD/DVD devices are prone to die due to dirt & dust, which can
>>>> coat the lens. If your environment is not air-conditioned, or if people
>>>> are allowed to smoke, then your optical devices are likely to die early.

>>> Are you suggesting that a simple lens cleaning might restore errant devices?

>> Yes, with smokers.

>>> I don't have smoke,

>> Then that isnt your problem.

>>> but I do have dust, and a "test" device causing issues right
>>> now (the subject to be replaced) that I could run a pilot on.

>> Wouldnt hurt to try cleaning the lens, but it isnt likely to help if you arent a smoker.

> Its not possible to clean a Smoke Damaged Laser Assembly,

The problem aint damage, its just a film of the smoke residue on
the lens and its perfectly possible to get that off with isopropanol.

> as it get on more parts that you can get at,
> like the Mirror and the bottom of the Lens.

It doesnt matter unless its in the optical path unless the levels are very bad.

> I should know as I fixed many CD/DVD Players..

But dont understand the basics.

> Smokers even kill TV's

Not very often.


From: Rod Speed on
Frank Williams wrote
> me <noemail(a)nothere.com> wrote
>> Bob Willard <BobwBSGS(a)TrashThis.comcast.net> wrote
>>> me wrote

>>>> Looking for recommendations for a brand of DVD/CD reader/writer.
>>>> Seems like all those I've purchased, regardless of name brand, die
>>>> in a coupe years. Are there any that last longer? I see some LG &
>>>> Samsung for low prices, are they junk or just as good as the rest
>>>> of the crowd?

>>>> FWIW, this is for an IDE interface.

>>> All CD/DVD devices are prone to die due to dirt & dust, which can
>>> coat the lens. If your environment is not air-conditioned, or if
>>> people are allowed to smoke, then your optical devices are likely
>>> to die early.

>> Are you suggesting that a simple lens cleaning might restore errant
>> devices? I don't have smoke, but I do have dust, and a "test" device
>> causing issues right now (the subject to be replaced) that I could
>> run a pilot on.

> The Dust gets on to many parts, and it time stick like glue,

No it doesnt if its not a smoker's system.

> you have to use cotton buds and Isopropyl to clean some
> of the parts, but hard to clean underneath the lens.

It doesnt cause any real problem underneath the lens as long as it isnt
a smoker's system and isnt used in very high humidity enviroments.


From: Rod Speed on
Frank Williams wrote
> Rod Speed <rod.speed.aaa(a)gmail.com> wrote
>> Bob Willard wrote
>>> me wrote

>>>> Looking for recommendations for a brand of DVD/CD reader/writer.
>>>> Seems like all those I've purchased, regardless of name brand, die
>>>> in a coupe years. Are there any that last longer? I see some LG &
>>>> Samsung for low prices, are they junk or just as good as the rest
>>>> of the crowd?

>>>> FWIW, this is for an IDE interface.

>>> All CD/DVD devices are prone to die due to dirt & dust, which can
>>> coat the lens. If your environment is not air-conditioned, or if
>>> people are allowed to smoke, then your optical devices are likely
>>> to die early.

>> Its not die so much with smokers, the smoke just
>> coats the lense eventually and can be cleaned off.

> No you Can't as it gets into every thing..

Yes you can. It isnt a problem unless its in the optical path.
The voltage levels arent high enough to be a problem in a DVD drive.