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From: Ray Fischer on 28 Feb 2010 18:12
nospam <nospam(a)nospam.invalid> wrote:
> Alfred Molon <alfred_molon(a)yahoo.com> wrote:
>> A 10MP full colour camera would be competitive - at least for what
>> concerns the resolution - with the current crop of 12-15MP DSLRs.
>maybe, but a 10 mp full colour camera does not exist.
Actually, Hasselblad annouced a new medium-format camera that can do
full-color images by shifting a Bayer-sensor one by pixel for each of
It is, of course, not cheap and not suited to moving scenes.
From: nospam on 28 Feb 2010 18:16
In article <4b8af84d$0$1617$742ec2ed(a)news.sonic.net>, Ray Fischer
> Actually, Hasselblad annouced a new medium-format camera that can do
> full-color images by shifting a Bayer-sensor one by pixel for each of
> three exposures.
it's basically a variant on taking 3 exposures and combining them later.
> It is, of course, not cheap and not suited to moving scenes.
From: David J Taylor on 1 Mar 2010 01:32
"Alfred Molon" <alfred_molon(a)yahoo.com> wrote in message
> In article <hmdjf1$g7l$1(a)news.eternal-september.org>, david-
> taylor(a)blueyonder.co.uk.invalid says...
>> I suggested comparing today's cameras
>> of similar effective resolution (citing a 4.6MP Foveon and 12MP Bayer
>> such cameras)
> 4.6Mp is not a "similar effective" resolution as a 12MP. A 4.6MP full
> colour camera has a similar effective resolution of a 7MP bayer camera
> (rough guesstimate, which obviously depends on the scene photographed).
> But comparing a 4.6MP (full colour) camera with a 12MP bayer camera does
> not make much sense.
> A 10MP full colour camera would be competitive - at least for what
> concerns the resolution - with the current crop of 12-15MP DSLRs. It
> would have larger pixels, far fewer aliasing problems and not put such
> high demands on the optical resolution of the lens and diffraction would
> be less of a problem, meaning that you could use smaller apertures.
> Alfred Molon
If, as you say, it only needs a 7MP Bayer camera to equal a 4.6MP Foveon
camera, then Sigma has already lost the battle.
My original question remains, although I choose to rephrase it: how big a
print and how close to it do you need to be (more accurately, what angle
does a pixel subtend) to see the extra colour resolution in today's Foveon
cameras versus today's Bayer cameras?
As the pixel size in a 10MP Foveon camera would be smaller than the 4
Bayer pixels in a 12-15MP DSLR, not larger, it could place higher demands
on the lenses, not less, and diffraction could be more of a problem.
From: Alfred Molon on 1 Mar 2010 01:53
In article <280220101443477982%nospam(a)nospam.invalid>,
> it makes a lot of sense, since competing cameras are 12 mp (and up).
Do you also compare APS-C cameras with medium format ones?
> the lens isn't the limiting factor, yet.
Yes it is when you have 18MP in an APS-C sensor.
Olympus E-series DSLRs and micro 4/3 forum at
http://myolympus.org/ photo sharing site
From: Alfred Molon on 1 Mar 2010 02:03
In article <280220101443447779%nospam(a)nospam.invalid>,
> a sensor with three layers is going to be much more complex to
> manufacture than one with only one layer, not to mention that there
> isn't the manufacturing volume to keep costs low.
Most modern chips have multiple layers.
> also, the thickness of each layer must be held to extremely tight
> tolerances or there will be a colour shift,
Generally speaking every semiconductor manufacturing process must be
kept in tight tolerances to maximise the yield.
> and to help address that,
> foveon has said that *each* camera has to be individually calibrated,
> adding yet another expense.
But the camera calibration step does not depend on whether the number of
pixels is 4.6 or 10 million.
http://www.molon.de - Photos of Asia, Africa and Europe