Microsoft ending newsgroup support
in [MFC]
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From: Hector Santos on 6 May 2010 11:41 After reviewing David Threadwell video discussing Live Services, this is all possible with the Live Framework. So we are talking about the exposure of the API via a simple layer for clients to use, including MUAs. This presents new market opportunities for RFC based MUAs to begin to implement new products. This also presents a new market opportunity for a "Wildcat! Live Exchange" <tm> for us to integrate into our Application Server. So folks, this is not really much about the discontinuing of the Microsoft NNTP Servers but rather promoting a push for Microsoft product users to the preferred centralized Live "network" and storage of data. I personally do not see a reason why that should be lost other than not having more control of the input side of it, but starting with a new controlled and single source storage/cloud of information is probably not a bad idea. The key is access. I don't think people should sweat it much. If NNTP access is still preferred with their favorite MUA, the current bridge is a start, but I am very sure that will be other gateway software made available using the Live Framework SDK. I just hope that Ozzie doesn't get the idea that they should TAX users or providers who accessing the information. Remember, that is still always part of the equation. Many software, like our product offers the accounting for such activity but it is very limited usage today. It only worked well for special trade services where end-users have no choice to pay extra fees for different tiers of technical support services. -- Hector Santos wrote: > David Ching wrote: > >> "Hector Santos" <sant9442(a)nospam.gmail.com> wrote in message >> news:u5Ul6CR7KHA.420(a)TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl... >>> Expect offloaded native GUI desktop clients to be available soon enough. >>> >>> My advice to them is to publish an API and allow the new industry >>> from here on out to write better or custom interfaces. Otherwise, it >>> will be a constant cost burden to them and no doubt, someone will >>> reverse engineer it, so take control of that by getting releasing an >>> API. >>> >> >> Microsoft originally had a Windows client written in WPF and in fact >> it is still available but probably doesn't work because it hasn't been >> updated to the latest forum API's: http://msdnforumsclient.codeplex.com/ >> >> They abandoned this and then focused on the NNTP Bridge. This is in >> light that people were complaining the UI was inferior to popular NNTP >> newsreaders. So for once Microsoft listened and gave what was asked >> for: a way to re-purpose NNTP newsreaders for use with the MS forums. >> >> The problem now is the Bridge still has issues with popular NNTP >> newsreaders, notice how they have "tiers" of support for various >> newsreaders with the Microsoft newsreaders being in the top tier. >> Even the top tier newsreaders have issues, the main one getting a lot >> of noise esp. by our own David Wilkinson is the "mismatched subject >> and body" problem. As well, users are now saying, "well since this is >> NNTP why doesn't MS host the NNTP server instead of me running it >> locally. I don't want to install new software on my PC. And the >> bridge doesn't work on the Mac." So the bridge is not perfect and may >> not ever be due to mismatches between NNTP and the forum back end. >> >> All this to say: it will be some time before MS opens the forum API's >> to 3rd parties, if ever. > > I'm currently doing research and I believe it is all already available > with Microsoft Live SDK. However, the REST protocol my not be well > established yet. Its not like impossible to reverse engineer, in fact, > its quite simple, just hover your mouse over the URL to see the common > pattern to access a forums list, a forum, a topic, a message, etc and > GET the request, and parse the result. I'm sure there is a URL option > that defines the output forum, like XML or RSS. > > But overall, with the diverse nature of users, technically, there should > be no problem here. They need experts! I hope this isn't new pet > projects for a few employees that have to learn on their own what long > understood all the framework issues. You need a "CZAR" that oversees > all the different angles. > > We do it with a centralized backend storage with multiple interfaces: > > Console Interface (supports the "Extras") > Native GUI desktop interface (supports the "Extras") > Web Interface (supports the "Extras") > POP3 interface (RFC 2822 format) > NNTP interface (RFC 2822 format) > Microsoft Exchange for Outlook (RFC 2822 format) > > and we are working on IMAP: > > IMAP interface (RFC 2822 format, supports "some" extras) > > (pondering, did I miss any?) > > Anyway, this is only all possible with a common API. > > Microsoft can actually make a big play here by offering RFC 2822 > eXtended headers to help support the "Extras" because right now RFC > based MUAs do not support any eXtended headers. We keep talking about > it for all kinds of new MUA interface needs but there is no real push > because there is no big SOURCE of information to invest in this > development. Web rendering is the only real solution but there is no > common MAIL structure for all other than RFC 2822. But if we are just > talking about Microsoft, I can guarantee there will be a market for MUA > vendors to support "Microsoft Mail Extensions." That is all it often > takes when the big gorilla to support new ideas. > > The MS NNTP bridge developer can expose this information itself and the > clients can do it. Or even the MS NNTP Servers if they choose to keep it. > > -- HLS
From: David Ching on 6 May 2010 12:29 "Hector Santos" <sant9442(a)nospam.gmail.com> wrote in message news:uLsiVKT7KHA.1888(a)TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl... > After reviewing David Threadwell video discussing Live Services, this is > all possible with the Live Framework. > That's great Hector, I hadn't heard of the Live Framework. BTW, I'm not sure you can access it but check out https://connect.microsoft.com/MicrosoftForums/messageboards/community.aspx for access to the NNTP bridge discussion newsgroup. -- David
From: Cholo Lennon on 6 May 2010 12:58 On 04/05/2010 22:22, MP wrote: > Microsoft said it plans to end support for more than 4,000 old-style > newsgroups starting next month, pushing users instead to discussion > forums such as those found on the Microsoft Answers, TechNet, and MSDN > sites. > > Although venerable, Microsoft said that so-called NNTP newsgroups are > past their time in terms of being usable and secure. > > Link: > > http://news.cnet.com/8301-13860_3-20004109-56.htm > > Mike P Very sad news... another stupid decision from Microsoft :-( What can I say... web forms aren't the way to go... -- Cholo Lennon Bs.As. ARG
From: Bo Persson on 6 May 2010 13:44 Ajay Kalra wrote: >> There is an MFC >> forum:http://social.msdn.microsoft.com/Forums/en-US/vcmfcatl/threads > > Is this going to be the new place for those who are here? No.
From: Hector Santos on 6 May 2010 13:51
David Ching wrote: > "Hector Santos" <sant9442(a)nospam.gmail.com> wrote in message > news:uLsiVKT7KHA.1888(a)TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl... >> After reviewing David Threadwell video discussing Live Services, this >> is all possible with the Live Framework. >> > > That's great Hector, I hadn't heard of the Live Framework. BTW, I'm not > sure you can access it but check out > https://connect.microsoft.com/MicrosoftForums/messageboards/community.aspx > for access to the NNTP bridge discussion newsgroup. > > -- David > > I was there already. :) Here is how to start developing for Live Services: http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/bb404791.aspx Comes with excellent C# example. -- HLS |